Black paint mystery?!

[Eugen]

The newbie is back with a few questions regarding my holster. I obtained this holster with a 1939 military stamped Luger recently. As you can see in the photos the holster is spray painted with black paint?! Yikes! Was this the work of an errant prior owner or was it done early in its life for a purpose, such as for a color guard, sentry duty of a publically visible location, or other ceremonial purpose? When I was in the military many years ago, the pressure to achieve a high gloss shine on leather shoes and such would lead to some guy’s coming up with many schemes to out shine the others. Did someone get the rattle can out in the 60’s or is this a period correct German military procedure?

That being said I am inclined to believe it was some misguided attempt much later to make an old holster look good. I have made an online purchase of a book on Luger holsters that I have yet to receive. Hoping that be helpful. Additionally, I was hoping to tap the collective knowledge of folks on this forum for any insight on my quest for understanding. If you cannot tell from the photos, on the back of the holster are the following stampings: “eue/40”, eagle over swastika above “WaA300” and then “P.08”

If I am advised it definitely does not belong on the holster, then I guess I should remove it. Do you have any suggestions as to how to do this without damaging the leather or the patina? In many places it is easily flaked off with the gentle persuasion of my thumb nail. On other areas the paint may be more tenacious.

As to the holsters background, it came with the 1939 luger and was a GI bring back (as I have detailed in another post). After the local GI died in 2004 and the spouse died last year, the family sold it to a guy that only owned it for a few months. So the Luger and the holster were not in too many hands.

Thank you for your thoughts and comments.

[Olle]

I have seen some holsters like that, and I was told that they were fixed up after the war, possibly by Russian arsenals.

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Olle

I have seen some holsters like that, and I was told that they were fixed up after the war, possibly by Russian arsenals.

Makes you wonder - Some members have reported their RC/VoPo Lugers coated with an almost tar-like finish...Maybe this holster was coated with the same finish???

[lugerholsterrepair]

It's a little shiny but doesn't look spray painted to me. Wouldn't the roller buckle be painted too?

Is there any overspray under the top? I didn't see any. Could be just a wax.

[alanint]

This looks like roll-on shoe polish to me. I cannot recommend anything to remove it without endangering the holster itself, but much of it may wear off in time.

[Eugen]

Originally Posted by Olle

I have seen some holsters like that, and I was told that they were fixed up after the war, possibly by Russian arsenals.

Olle, you mention an interesting possibility. Given this was a GI bring back, I wonder if the Russians would have possessed it at all.

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

It's a little shiny but doesn't look spray painted to me. Wouldn't the roller buckle be painted too?

Is there any overspray under the top? I didn't see any. Could be just a wax.

LHR, perhaps if my photography skills and equipment were better, you would be able to see the paint like product that was applied much more clearly. I am able to use my finger nails to flake off some of the hard black 'paint' or whatever it is. The paint does not adhere to the finished leather very well in some of the spots I chose to experiment with scraping a little of it off.

Yes, the buckle was painted. I did begin to meticulously thumb nail off some of the crusty, flaky paint from the buckle, when I decided to smarten up and seek some advice from the forum before I damaged the possible historic value of the painted holster.

I do believe that the product was sprayed on because there is a run in the 'paint' between the belt straps from over application. Regretfully, the run or drip of the paint is not very clearly shown in the photo I provided. But, it is noticeable with the naked eyeball examination when holding the holster. LOL

Originally Posted by alanint

This looks like roll-on shoe polish to me. I cannot recommend anything to remove it without endangering the holster itself, but much of it may wear off in time.

alanint, yes, it could be a polish like product with some paint characteristics. But, the product used on the holster appears thinner and very much suggesting to me that it was sprayed applied. On my dress shoes I use a black roll-on type shoe sole trim product that hardens and works well on the visible portion of the shoe soles. It is very different than regular shoe polish, as it hardens and coats much more like paint. Still this stuff on my holster is much more brittle and chips and flakes off like a bad paint job with no prep work. LOL


Many thanks to all of you for your thoughts on my mystery product. I also have be researching threads on this forum to increase my knowledge of holster care. I am learning so much in my short time here. Again, thank you.

I am planning a trip to Simpsons LTD gun shop that is a few hours drive from where I live. I may take the holster to them and get there opinion. Anyway I believe it prudent to leave the holster alone until I get more education on the matter. I'll keep every one posted.

[Olle]

Originally Posted by Eugen

Olle, you mention an interesting possibility. Given this was a GI bring back, I wonder if the Russians would have possessed it at all.

Probably not, if that's the case it's more than likely a "Bubba enhancement".

I'm just racking my brain trying to remember where I heard this. It was mentioned in a discussion about some other kind of holster where the closure strap stud had a similar "paint" finish, and it was said that it was a type of refurbish they did on captured holsters somewhere in Eastern Europe.

[wlyon]

I would try careful scrubbing with 0000 steel wool. Do not apply much pressure. Try it on a belt loop first. I have removed paint and wax this way. Just ,go slow and easy. Bill

[Mac Cat]

“eue/40”, eagle over swastika above “WaA300” and then “P.08”

eue = Otto Reichel, Ihn. Rudolf Fisher, Lederwarenfabrik, Lengfeld, Erzbridge,
(Lengfeld is 2 miles south of Suhl, or if it's spelled Lengefeld, that further east by Dressen - both spellings are given)

(The Standard Dictionary of Proof Marks, German Ordinance Codes. p.180 - G. Wirnsberger)

I haven't seen a stamp that clean before and the "/40" format may mean "1940".

The "WaA300" is a German Army "Waffenamt Inspectors Number" stamp.
300 would be correct for Fisher, Rudolf (Reichel)
(Luger Holstgers & Accessories of the 20th Century, p. 203,, - Eugene J. Bender)


And "P.08" would be correct.

It's just the date that didn't look right to me. I haven't seen another done that way.

[Sergio Natali]

I'm not too sure about using 0000 steel wool, to me it looks like some sort of shoe polish.

[Eugen]

Originally Posted by luger.parabellum

I'm not too sure about using 0000 steel wool, to me it looks like some sort of shoe polish.

Sergio, I might not even need to consider the 0000 as Bill suggests as this product (in the very limited areas I sampled) can be removed, well, like fingernail polish comes off of ones finger nails by simply chipping it off with a thumb nail. I was married enough years (God rest her soul) to have witnessed finger nail polish chipping. LOL

If this is shoe polish then I have never seen any polish like this sold by Kiwi. LOL In other words this is definitely not a conventional type of shoe polish that smears on and stays relatively soft and does not harden or chip.

[lugerholsterrepair]

I would try cleaning it with acetone first to see if that takes it off. Acetone won't hurt the leather. I use a fingernail polish remover with 75% or more acetone content.

[Eugen]

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

I would try cleaning it with acetone first to see if that takes it off. Acetone won't hurt the leather. I use a fingernail polish remover with 75% or more acetone content.

Wow, I didn't know that! I would have thought that such chemicals would damage the leather. Not so apparently. I may try that if I attempt to remove it all. Thanks for the tip.

What a helpful forum! So many great tips.

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by Eugen

Wow, I didn't know that! I would have thought that such chemicals would damage the leather. Not so apparently. I may try that if I attempt to remove it all. Thanks for the tip.

What a helpful forum! So many great tips.

Well, acetone won't damage your skin = leather!
Will take the moisture out though, so you may need to feed after cleaning.

Why is everyone so "afraid" of solvents? (sorry, just the chemist in me coming out).
Now "plastic" and solvent is another story.

[lugerholsterrepair]

Tandy leather Corp. bottles up acetone, calls it leather cleaner and sells it as just that. Fingernail polish can be had in many % variations and some with a pleasant scent. Plus the bottles are better for storage. Let us know how it works! I use it all the time.

I would try careful scrubbing with 0000 steel wool. Do not apply much pressure. Try it on a belt loop first. I have removed paint and wax this way. Just ,go slow and easy. Bill is correct. Used lightly, 0000 steel wool can be effective. I have even used 2000 grit sandpaper on occasion.

[Sieger]

Hi,

This looks like a cheap liquid black shoe polish job from the 1960s or 1970s to me.


Sieger

[Eugen]

A few months have passed since I posted my concern over this black spray “paint” applied to my holster. After several of you assured me that this paint job was not 'correct', I decide to try to, oh so gently, scrap it off with a polymer chisel tool (used for automotive interior work). This seems to have worked well based on the outcome and I wanted to share my work with my friends on the forum. (Note photos taken at the beginning of this thread that show the shinny black paint.)

It took me about 6 hours over several days of tediously scraping the leather to scrape and chip away this darn paint. In some areas like the front of the holster the paint came off more easily. Then in others, like the belt straps and holster strap, the paint clung so tightly to the leather that I feared damaging the leather if I attempted to apply more pressure to remove the paint; so some paint remains. My photo taking ability does not show the dramatically improved appearance of removing the paint as it does it when holding the holster. You can see the small paint flakes comin off. I might try the use of acetone, as several have suggested, to remove the remaining small flecks of paint. The last two photos show the nearly completely finished restored work. I did apply some Connelly leather product after the work to nurture the leather. (Thanks for the tip, Jerry.)

I am so much happier as it stands and even my fiancé noticed the significant improvement.

[Edward Tinker]

hey, looks great!

[sheepherder]

Originally Posted by Edward Tinker

hey, looks great!

It does indeed!

How did you 'whiten' the stitching???

And what is that little hooked tool???

[lugerholsterrepair]

Donald, Very nicely done!