Anomalous New Model Parabellum production

Dwight Gruber · 10-13-2016, 09:21 PM

New Model Parabellum production—pistols of 7,65 or 9mm caliber, grip safety, no stock lug, routed safety indicator—ceased production sometime during 1913, around sn 69000. From that serial range reported pistols are entirely P08 commercial pistols (9mm, no grip safety, GESICHERT marked) without stock lug (08C).

The P08 stock lug addition was introduced to army production in August 1913, and P08 commercial pistols with stock lug (P08 proper) began to appear in the mid-sn 70100 serial range. Shortly thereafter, as early as sn 70610, P08 commercial pistols with grip safeties began to appear. Most of the P08 grip safety commercials are reported in the sn 71166-71400 serial range, although there are several outliers.

Although most of these P08 grip safety commercials are reported with stock lugs, there are two reported without, and several with no report. This has been the origin of a spirited discussion about the nature of the non-stock-lug pistols http://luger.gunboards.com/showthrea...mmercial+frame, with no definitive conclusion.

Earlier this year P08 grip safety commercial sn 72571 sans stock lug appeared on auction, and I saw an opportunity to make a direct comparison myself. Satisfied with the serial number and auction description, I bid and won the pistol.

When it arrived I unpacked it and began my examination confident that I would finally learn something concrete about the non-stock-lug grip-safety P08. When I looked at the safety I learned something else entirely.

Rather than the expected GESICHERT safety mark, this pistol has a routed safety indicator. When I examined the bottom of the grip frame at the magazine well, it was clear that this pistol was originally manufactured without a stock lug.

Frankly, if I had paid more attention, this would not have been a surprise. The auction photo showed the absence of the upper GESICHERT mark. More importantly, the serial number appears in the commercial database. It is one of three adjacent reports—sn 72571, sn 72621, and sn 72646—which share anomalous designations and comment.

In late 1914 the recoil spring well changed to a flat profile, rather than retaining the vestigial remnant of the grip safety pedestal. This shows up in commercial production as early as sn 71857. With this pistol in hand, it is possible to confirm the continuation of New Model Parabellum production—at least in a small way—into 1914.

And I still want to examine a grip-safety P08 commercial without stock lug.

--Dwight

10-13-2016, 09:21 PM	#1
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,902 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,318 Times in 431 Posts	Anomalous New Model Parabellum production New Model Parabellum production—pistols of 7,65 or 9mm caliber, grip safety, no stock lug, routed safety indicator—ceased production sometime during 1913, around sn 69000. From that serial range reported pistols are entirely P08 commercial pistols (9mm, no grip safety, GESICHERT marked) without stock lug (08C). The P08 stock lug addition was introduced to army production in August 1913, and P08 commercial pistols with stock lug (P08 proper) began to appear in the mid-sn 70100 serial range. Shortly thereafter, as early as sn 70610, P08 commercial pistols with grip safeties began to appear. Most of the P08 grip safety commercials are reported in the sn 71166-71400 serial range, although there are several outliers. Although most of these P08 grip safety commercials are reported with stock lugs, there are two reported without, and several with no report. This has been the origin of a spirited discussion about the nature of the non-stock-lug pistols http://luger.gunboards.com/showthrea...mmercial+frame, with no definitive conclusion. Earlier this year P08 grip safety commercial sn 72571 sans stock lug appeared on auction, and I saw an opportunity to make a direct comparison myself. Satisfied with the serial number and auction description, I bid and won the pistol. When it arrived I unpacked it and began my examination confident that I would finally learn something concrete about the non-stock-lug grip-safety P08. When I looked at the safety I learned something else entirely. Rather than the expected GESICHERT safety mark, this pistol has a routed safety indicator. When I examined the bottom of the grip frame at the magazine well, it was clear that this pistol was originally manufactured without a stock lug. Frankly, if I had paid more attention, this would not have been a surprise. The auction photo showed the absence of the upper GESICHERT mark. More importantly, the serial number appears in the commercial database. It is one of three adjacent reports—sn 72571, sn 72621, and sn 72646—which share anomalous designations and comment. In late 1914 the recoil spring well changed to a flat profile, rather than retaining the vestigial remnant of the grip safety pedestal. This shows up in commercial production as early as sn 71857. With this pistol in hand, it is possible to confirm the continuation of New Model Parabellum production—at least in a small way—into 1914. And I still want to examine a grip-safety P08 commercial without stock lug. --Dwight Attached Thumbnails Last edited by Dwight Gruber; 10-14-2016 at 03:46 PM.