DWM/Mauser re-work? BKIW?

waltherguy · 08-15-2006, 06:23 PM

Hello all,

Well picked up a strange one today. First and foremost I want to thank Frank for all his advice before I purchased this one. I'm not sure if this is a Mauser re-work? possibly a BKIW? It has a "DWM" stamp & no date. No "sear safety" & No "Mag safety" Serial is "25" with an "r" suffix.

It came with an FXO mag, and the strawed parts appear to have been blued (possibly post-war?) but show alot of wear so it was done along time ago. It has Crown/N stamps which appear to have been done earlier, and the only proof is one I've never seen before? From what I can make out its an Eagle "H1a220" maybe "H1a120"? Maybe I'm totally off but thats what it appears to be? (see attached Pic). The barrel has the Mauser Eagle/355 stamp.

Everything appears matching, and is heavily numbered including "25" in two places on the side plate, take down lever, and one on the safety lever. Although the Grips & firing pin are not numbered? there is also a letter "G" under the left grip on the frame.

Thank you all in advance! I can't wait to get some more info on this. Maybe its a junky shooter, maybe something rare? I have a ton of pics, so I'll just post what I feel is worth seeing, and can happily post more upon request.

Thanks!
Reggie

Dwight Gruber · 08-15-2006, 08:28 PM

Reggie,

Very interesting Luger.

The right reciever mark is an eagle over HZa(something)t22, the stamp of a Heeres Zeugamt or Army weapons depot. The stamp identifies which depot performed modifications to this Luger, and its location. Without knowing the unreadable letter it is impossible to determine location, and it may not be possible in any case--Heeres Zeugamt is an evolving study.

The e/355 is a WaffenAmt inspector mark, not necessarily having anything to do with Mauser.

This, then, is originally an Alphabet Commercial, sn 25r, which made its way to the government arms depot HZa(x)t20, where, at some time, it was rebarrelled (I am presuming it is in 9mm) and number re-stamped in the military--exposed--fashion. The takedown lever was replaced (it does not bear its bottom-edge number). It is interesting that the barrel is WaA stamped, rather than having a 42 Mauser relacement part stamp.

Some other questions come to mind which might help pin down this Luger's circumstance, or at least tell a bit more of its story. What are the marks on the bottom of the barrel? Is the rear toggle pin serial numbered? Might the unreadable letter in the HZa stamp be J?

--Dwight

waltherguy · 08-15-2006, 09:07 PM

Hi Dwight,

Thanks for the post. Very interesting indeed. I bought this online with only having a few pics to go by, and the dealer selling it new very little about Lugers. I wasn't really sure what I was getting, so I was either overpaying for a shooter, or could be getting something really neat.

As matter of fact, the takedown lever does have the bottom numbered, as does the side plate (see attached pic). The breechlock has been stamped "25" but at the end where the firing pin is inserted, it is stamped "64."

I will also attach pics of the toggle pin, and the bottom of the barrel (stamped "25" and "882" under). The (Hza) stamp very well could be a "j" but honestly, the more I look at it.. It looks like an "L" to me? Its worn just enough that I can't really make it out.

Thanks again for the help! This is why I have the Luger bug so much! Learn something new with each gun! Any more pic request, I'll be happy to post them.

Reggie

waltherguy · 08-15-2006, 10:54 PM

One more pic of the proof.. tried to get zoomed in as much as possible..

Thanks!

waltherguy · 08-16-2006, 12:48 AM

One more correction.. The barrel stamp is an Eagle/655.. not 355. Sorry about that! There is also another small eagle stamp next to the "882" on the bottom of the barrel.... thanks all!

08-17-2006, 01:50 PM

wow, nice Luger. I like it just as it is cause it has character. The grips look very nice from what I can see and overall I like the entire gun. How much did you say you paid for it?
Bob

Dwight Gruber · 08-17-2006, 02:36 PM

Reggie,

Thanks for the additional pictures and info.

The numbered toggle pin was added during work on this gun sometime after 1932. The edge number on the takedown suggests that this is the actual part after all.

Breechblocks of Alphabet Commercials are commonly found with a number different from the serial number on their rear face. At this juncture the reason is unknown.

e/655 on the barrel makes much more sense. It would be interestng to know what the eagle by the barrel guage looks like.

--Dwight

waltherguy · 08-17-2006, 03:46 PM

Thanks for the Feedback Guys! And thank you for all the info Dwight. The best way to describe the eagle by the barrel gauge is.. well it looks like the eagle on the 41/42 Mauser proofs... and its almost looks like it has a Letter "K" underneath, but I could be totally wrong it might just be a scratch hehe.. but its too small to make out. Tried to get a picture but just too small to get my camara to focus. Interesting area of Lugers I knew nothing about.. Thanks again! Love to hear more input.

Reggie

08-15-2006, 06:23 PM	#1
waltherguy User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: FL Posts: 201 Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	DWM/Mauser re-work? BKIW? Hello all, Well picked up a strange one today. First and foremost I want to thank Frank for all his advice before I purchased this one. I'm not sure if this is a Mauser re-work? possibly a BKIW? It has a "DWM" stamp & no date. No "sear safety" & No "Mag safety" Serial is "25" with an "r" suffix. It came with an FXO mag, and the strawed parts appear to have been blued (possibly post-war?) but show alot of wear so it was done along time ago. It has Crown/N stamps which appear to have been done earlier, and the only proof is one I've never seen before? From what I can make out its an Eagle "H1a220" maybe "H1a120"? Maybe I'm totally off but thats what it appears to be? (see attached Pic). The barrel has the Mauser Eagle/355 stamp. Everything appears matching, and is heavily numbered including "25" in two places on the side plate, take down lever, and one on the safety lever. Although the Grips & firing pin are not numbered? there is also a letter "G" under the left grip on the frame. Thank you all in advance! I can't wait to get some more info on this. Maybe its a junky shooter, maybe something rare? I have a ton of pics, so I'll just post what I feel is worth seeing, and can happily post more upon request. Thanks! Reggie __________________ "In a man to man fight the winner is the one who puts an extra round in his magazine" -Field Marshal Erwin Rommel

08-15-2006, 09:07 PM	#3
waltherguy User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: FL Posts: 201 Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi Dwight, Thanks for the post. Very interesting indeed. I bought this online with only having a few pics to go by, and the dealer selling it new very little about Lugers. I wasn't really sure what I was getting, so I was either overpaying for a shooter, or could be getting something really neat. As matter of fact, the takedown lever does have the bottom numbered, as does the side plate (see attached pic). The breechlock has been stamped "25" but at the end where the firing pin is inserted, it is stamped "64." I will also attach pics of the toggle pin, and the bottom of the barrel (stamped "25" and "882" under). The (Hza) stamp very well could be a "j" but honestly, the more I look at it.. It looks like an "L" to me? Its worn just enough that I can't really make it out. Thanks again for the help! This is why I have the Luger bug so much! Learn something new with each gun! Any more pic request, I'll be happy to post them. Reggie __________________ "In a man to man fight the winner is the one who puts an extra round in his magazine" -Field Marshal Erwin Rommel

08-15-2006, 10:54 PM	#4
waltherguy User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: FL Posts: 201 Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	One more pic of the proof.. tried to get zoomed in as much as possible.. Thanks! __________________ "In a man to man fight the winner is the one who puts an extra round in his magazine" -Field Marshal Erwin Rommel

08-16-2006, 12:48 AM	#5
waltherguy User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: FL Posts: 201 Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	One more correction.. The barrel stamp is an Eagle/655.. not 355. Sorry about that! There is also another small eagle stamp next to the "882" on the bottom of the barrel.... thanks all! __________________ "In a man to man fight the winner is the one who puts an extra round in his magazine" -Field Marshal Erwin Rommel

08-17-2006, 03:46 PM	#8
waltherguy User Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: FL Posts: 201 Thanks: 5 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for the Feedback Guys! And thank you for all the info Dwight. The best way to describe the eagle by the barrel gauge is.. well it looks like the eagle on the 41/42 Mauser proofs... and its almost looks like it has a Letter "K" underneath, but I could be totally wrong it might just be a scratch hehe.. but its too small to make out. Tried to get a picture but just too small to get my camara to focus. Interesting area of Lugers I knew nothing about.. Thanks again! Love to hear more input. Reggie __________________ "In a man to man fight the winner is the one who puts an extra round in his magazine" -Field Marshal Erwin Rommel

08-15-2006, 08:28 PM	#2
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,902 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,318 Times in 431 Posts	Reggie, Very interesting Luger. The right reciever mark is an eagle over HZa(something)t22, the stamp of a Heeres Zeugamt or Army weapons depot. The stamp identifies which depot performed modifications to this Luger, and its location. Without knowing the unreadable letter it is impossible to determine location, and it may not be possible in any case--Heeres Zeugamt is an evolving study. The e/355 is a WaffenAmt inspector mark, not necessarily having anything to do with Mauser. This, then, is originally an Alphabet Commercial, sn 25r, which made its way to the government arms depot HZa(x)t20, where, at some time, it was rebarrelled (I am presuming it is in 9mm) and number re-stamped in the military--exposed--fashion. The takedown lever was replaced (it does not bear its bottom-edge number). It is interesting that the barrel is WaA stamped, rather than having a 42 Mauser relacement part stamp. Some other questions come to mind which might help pin down this Luger's circumstance, or at least tell a bit more of its story. What are the marks on the bottom of the barrel? Is the rear toggle pin serial numbered? Might the unreadable letter in the HZa stamp be J? --Dwight

08-17-2006, 01:50 PM	#6
ironcross4148 Guest Posts: n/a	wow, nice Luger. I like it just as it is cause it has character. The grips look very nice from what I can see and overall I like the entire gun. How much did you say you paid for it? Bob

08-17-2006, 02:36 PM	#7
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,902 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,318 Times in 431 Posts	Reggie, Thanks for the additional pictures and info. The numbered toggle pin was added during work on this gun sometime after 1932. The edge number on the takedown suggests that this is the actual part after all. Breechblocks of Alphabet Commercials are commonly found with a number different from the serial number on their rear face. At this juncture the reason is unknown. e/655 on the barrel makes much more sense. It would be interestng to know what the eagle by the barrel guage looks like. --Dwight