Rookie question re: take down lever

Fenian · 02-04-2010, 10:17 PM

Hi

I've read on another forum that you need to depress the muzzle before you move the take down lever to begin disassembly. Is this necessary or something that's overstated?

I didn't notice this step in the following disassembly video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SD9hq...eature=related

Thanks!

alanint · 02-04-2010, 10:53 PM

If you don't press the muzzle at least slightly, the take down lever will simply not move. This is why you often find buggered take down levers where people did not understand this principle and tried to force the lever down..

Edward Tinker · 02-04-2010, 10:53 PM

yes, it makes it possible.

Folks do it many ways;

1. I have seen Ralph pull the receiver back with one hand and the other he turns the take down

2. Push the barrel against something, table, leg etc and turn the take down

I am sure that it can be done with out pushing the barrel back, but I would assume its worn.

Ed

Edward Tinker · 02-04-2010, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alanint

If you don't press the muzzle at least slightly, the take down lever will simply not move. This is why you often find buggered take down levers where people did not understand this principle and tried to force the lever down..

and broken off ones too; I have gotten two that way and several with nasty screw driver scratches.

tomaustin · 02-04-2010, 11:09 PM

.......

alvin · 02-04-2010, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fenian

Hi

I've read on another forum that you need to depress the muzzle before you move the take down lever to begin disassembly. Is this necessary or something that's overstated?

I didn't notice this step in the following disassembly video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SD9hq...eature=related

Thanks!

The video is absolutely correct. Please note exactly what he did: he pull the toggle up with empty magazine, checked the chamber being empty, toggle/bolt assembly is locked by hold open, then he turned down TD level.

Since toggle/bolt was locked by hold open, the barrel is in its rear position, and the space behind the TD pin is cleared, so TD can turn. This turning is not by brute force and will not damage the gun.

policeluger · 02-04-2010, 11:14 PM

Ed....I hear there is a guy who is fair at repairing these broked TD levers........

Lugerdoc · 02-05-2010, 10:29 AM

I've always felt that starting to field strip your luger from the held open position on an emply mag was perferable to pushing the muzzle back on a hard surface, which might ding that area and affect accuracy. TH

Vlim · 02-05-2010, 01:17 PM

Yup:

A number of possible methods:
-Push muzzle against a flat surface (protect the muzzle against scratches, etc..).
-Push toggle back with one hand (as documented in the official manuals).
-Open toggle (the easiest and safest method, really).

Fenian · 02-05-2010, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alvin

The video is absolutely correct. Please note exactly what he did: he pull the toggle up with empty magazine, checked the chamber being empty, toggle/bolt assembly is locked by hold open, then he turned down TD level.

Since toggle/bolt was locked by hold open, the barrel is in its rear position, and the space behind the TD pin is cleared, so TD can turn. This turning is not by brute force and will not damage the gun.

OK, I understand.

The toggle held to the rear by the empty mag keeps the pistol out of battery, making it unnecessary to push the barrel back.

Gotcha.

alvin · 02-05-2010, 08:51 PM

Hi. It's close, but not exact. This gun's hold open device is not magazine follower although magazine follower does have a role in its function. It has a specific hold open latch activated by the button (on the follower) on the side of the magazine. When the magazine is empty, the magazine button pushes up the hold open latch, and the bolt will be blocked by the latch when it's open. It's like a modern gun.

Here is my question to firearm historians: Was Luger the first gun implement this type of magazine follower activated hold open latch? I know that Borchardt did not have hold open feature, and Mauser's hold open was by magazine follower.... but I don't know who invented this empty magazine activated latch feature which is almost universal on the modern pistol. Obviously, it's an important feature... Please help.

02-04-2010, 10:17 PM	#1
Fenian User Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 27 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Rookie question re: take down lever Hi I've read on another forum that you need to depress the muzzle before you move the take down lever to begin disassembly. Is this necessary or something that's overstated? I didn't notice this step in the following disassembly video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SD9hq...eature=related Thanks!

02-04-2010, 10:53 PM	#3
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,935 Thanks: 2,034 Thanked 4,533 Times in 2,093 Posts	yes, it makes it possible. Folks do it many ways; 1. I have seen Ralph pull the receiver back with one hand and the other he turns the take down 2. Push the barrel against something, table, leg etc and turn the take down I am sure that it can be done with out pushing the barrel back, but I would assume its worn. Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

02-04-2010, 11:09 PM	#5
tomaustin Lifer X5 Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: texas Posts: 708 Thanks: 87 Thanked 522 Times in 201 Posts	getting it off is only half of the process---you must do the same to get it back on.. .......

02-05-2010, 10:29 AM	#8
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	I've always felt that starting to field strip your luger from the held open position on an emply mag was perferable to pushing the muzzle back on a hard surface, which might ding that area and affect accuracy. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 [email protected]

02-04-2010, 10:53 PM	#2
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	If you don't press the muzzle at least slightly, the take down lever will simply not move. This is why you often find buggered take down levers where people did not understand this principle and tried to force the lever down..

02-04-2010, 11:14 PM	#7
policeluger RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Ca. Posts: 2,141 Thanks: 8 Thanked 89 Times in 54 Posts	Ed....I hear there is a guy who is fair at repairing these broked TD levers........

02-05-2010, 01:17 PM	#9
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,989 Times in 1,205 Posts	Yup: A number of possible methods: -Push muzzle against a flat surface (protect the muzzle against scratches, etc..). -Push toggle back with one hand (as documented in the official manuals). -Open toggle (the easiest and safest method, really).

02-05-2010, 08:51 PM	#11
alvin User Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: US Posts: 3,843 Thanks: 132 Thanked 729 Times in 438 Posts	Hi. It's close, but not exact. This gun's hold open device is not magazine follower although magazine follower does have a role in its function. It has a specific hold open latch activated by the button (on the follower) on the side of the magazine. When the magazine is empty, the magazine button pushes up the hold open latch, and the bolt will be blocked by the latch when it's open. It's like a modern gun. Here is my question to firearm historians: Was Luger the first gun implement this type of magazine follower activated hold open latch? I know that Borchardt did not have hold open feature, and Mauser's hold open was by magazine follower.... but I don't know who invented this empty magazine activated latch feature which is almost universal on the modern pistol. Obviously, it's an important feature... Please help.