1900 AE Shooter, and questions

[4 Scale]

I just received this 1900 model and thought I would post some pictures, and I had a few questions I'm hoping someone can help with.

First the pistol - I purchased this from forum member Markbritt (Mark). It's a 1900 AE, all matching but refinished by Mark (not restored). By "all matching" I mean barrel (very faint but the serial #9419 is there), frame, trigger, grips, take-down, receiver, all three toggle pieces, and grip safety. The pistol has made the rounds, as it is in Dwight's database with a note that the pistol is in "extremely poor condition - offered as a parts gun". It is a very worn, refinished surface, and can't imagine how it must have looked before Mark refinished it.

My guess is the pistol went through several refinishes over its life; the metal has been taken down to where the American Eagle stamping is as faint as it can be yet you can still detect it. I cleaned it up, fired about 25 rounds, cleaned it some more and gave it a coat of Renaissance Wax. Cleaning included brushing the grips with Acetone using a fine but stiff artist's paintbrush purchased for the purpose.

The only function issue was a sticky hold-open. The hold-open is not original to the pistol, but is a numbered replacement. I reduced and polished the side of the hold-open where there appeared to be friction, which fixed it.

[DavidJayUden]

Don't know what you paid, but it looks like a very nice shooter. Enjoy!
dju

[4 Scale]

Thanks dju. The price agreed to by the parties was $1,150.

I completely agree with Mark's decision to refinish the pistol over its various wear and wounds. He said it had no finish left when he got it, and in my opinion at that point the owner's best strategy is to re-blue to prevent further oxidation.

I have had a lot of fun comparing the pistol to my Mausers. It's got the "flaming bomb" proof, aka "bomb flamer" by a Luger collector from Mexico, fun to see that.

But, I have a couple questions I wanted to ask for help on:

1. The front sight is loose as it sits atop its ramp. It is so loose, it can be pushed off the ramp with a finger. Is there a best way to fix this? I was thinking LockTite?

2. The pistol shoots high at ten yards, about 15" high which amazed me because the group was reasonable - about 5" diameter (about what I get with my '38 Mauser 'shooter'). I would rate the bore as fair to good, good rifling with no pitting although there is some darkness and roughness in the grooves in some places. I don't see anything about the bore that could be throwing the rounds high. By that I mean, it doesn't seem bent or to have anything odd going on near the muzzle.

The only thing I can imagine to fix this is a custom taller front sight, but would appreciate any comments or ideas.

3. Is there a way to release the firing pin after cycling the action? (ha, the forum software will not allow me to use the word that also means "male chicken..."). My standard method with Mausers: retract the breechblock until tension, then depress trigger while returning the breechblock to rest -but on this pistol, that doesn't work. Instead I stick a pencil down the bore and release the firing pin against the eraser to cushion it, but is there a better way?

Thanks in advance for any advice on these.

[DavidJayUden]

I suspect that you have a standard P08 front sight insert, whereas the 1900's used a taller sight blade, thus yours shoots high. Let's let others weigh in on that, but yours just looks low to me.
dju

[ithacaartist]

Greg,

The de-cocking procedure you outlined is correct, but you didn't go quite far enough. It's easy to tell when the resistance is encountered, but you have to pull a little bit more just into the resistance. Pulling and holding the trigger while returning the breech block to battery finished the job.

What happens inside the gun is that this procedure allow the trigger lever in the side plate to maintain its ability to press in on the spring-loaded disconnector button on the front end of the sear bar. If you pull back too far, the barrel extension will move back, the lever will be "disconnected" from the trigger, and subsequent holding the trigger back will do nothing, allowing the gun to c0ck. Pulling back into the action's resistance relieves the tension at the sear/f.p. interface. The sear will not set when its bar is held in at the front, thus the firing pin returns all the way forward, within the block.

[4 Scale]

David thanks, after ready your post I inspected/measured. It seems to be the same height as a Mauser P. 08 front sight but the shape appears correct for a 1900 model, based on a check of Dave's 1900 Commercial and looking at the Simpson site.

[4 Scale]

Originally Posted by ithacaartist

The de-cocking procedure you outlined is correct, but you didn't go quite far enough.

Thanks! Ah, what a great forum where the Luger Grasshopper may learn at the knee of the masters. Now I not only know how to release the tension on the firing pin, but how to write "de-c0ck" in a way to get past the software....

[DonVoigt]

4 Scale,
I'm sorry you are having soooo much trouble with your new shooter,
obviously you must send it to me as soon as possible!

PS- it looks good, nice job on cleaning the grips.

[alanint]

Pull and toggle up above the zone where you start feeling spring tension upon lowering the toggle, (about half way up on most pistols). While holding the toggle in that half up position, pull the trigger while gently lowering the toggle manually.

This will release the striker/firing pin and it will slowly ride forward as the toggle is lowered.

HTHs

[DavidJayUden]

OK, you 1900 guys: Is the front sight on the orig. 1900's taller than the standard P08 sight blades?

dju

[4 Scale]

OK, I've now tried the 'modified' toggle release method suggested and have successfully de-c0cked the pistol thanks to Dave and Doug.

On the front sight, believe it or not Sarco claims to have three different 1900 model sights in stock, at 6.1mm, 6.77mm and 7.0mm height. I'm inclined to get the 7.0mm unless someone advises differently. They also have a surprisingly large inventory of other 1900 parts on hand.

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

4 Scale,
I'm sorry you are having soooo much trouble with your new shooter, obviously you must send it to me as soon as possible!

PS- it looks good, nice job on cleaning the grips.

Ha, Don I really appreciate you looking out for me but I think I'll struggle on a bit. However if I do give up, rather than throw it away I will send it to you.

Thanks for your kind words on the grips. The acetone/stiff-fine brush treatment seems to work wonders. Since posting the pictures above, I'v had a chance to micro-clean under the microscope and they look even better if I do say so myself. I may be nuts but to me the grips are a big part of the appearance of any Luger and I enjoy trying to improve them. Personally I like the grips to be lighter to set off the darker pistol finish, and acetone is very good at removing accumulated grime to produce a lighter more natural wood color.

[DonVoigt]

I have not tried acetone on grips-yet; but use it for lots of other "stuff".

Sounds better than scrubbing with soap! No pesky water to swell the grain.

I'm going to PM you my address so you don't have to mess with that front sight.

[sheepherder]

If your Luger is sitting on your Canon G11, what are you taking pics with???

[4 Scale]

Well Don we can always discuss, but for the moment I will keep plugging away. Even if this thing breaks or keeps shooting high, it still has value as a parts gun!

I have done a fair amount of research on grip restoration and have some woodworking background. In my opinion, acetone is the best solution to remove accumulated material on grips. It does not harm the wood it only removes non-wood material.

I do not recommend a toothbrush, those are too stiff and corse. Rather a fine-bristled, medium-stiff artist brush about 1/2" wide, available in any better art store. Per the microscope, most of the dark foreign material is in the grooves, and toothbrush bristles are simply too thick reach the base of checkering grooves. And they are a little too stiff in my opinion, with a toothbrush there is a slightly increased chance of damaging the checkering.

I pour acetone into a glass baking pan, about 1/4", and gently brush along the two checkering directions. Typically I change the bath several times, as it gets discolored. I am 100% sure (via microscope) that I remove grime without harming wood. I work fast - a minute or two per grip. You know you are done when brushing/rinsing stops darkening the acetone. Be sure to do it outdoor or with a respirator.

I know some collectors like to treat cleaned grips with boiled linseed oil and similar. With respect, I completely disagree. The oldest wood in the world (over 7,000 years old) got that way by being kept dry, cool and out of the sun. Oil and other foreign emulsions accelerate wood deterioration, based on my research which includes looking at some Smithsonian wood preservation papers.

I did some additional cleaning today, removing some stubborn junk using a #11 Xacto knife and the 'scope. I then used a very small amount of walnut penetrating resin stain to re-darken the tiny light areas caused by scraping off junk. I applied the stain with the point of a pin, again using the microscope. Here's a before and after.

[4 Scale]

Originally Posted by sheepherder

If your Luger is sitting on your Canon G11, what are you taking pics with???

Nikon D800. I was experimenting to try and obtain high depth of field and the Nikon was producing better results.

[Karl]

FYI, My 1900 shooter required a taller front sight that I made from a '96 Swedish Mauser sight. It measures about .025 from the sight base or about 6.5 mm. I suggest getting the tallest sight from Sarco and filing it down as needed.
KFS

[DavidJayUden]

There is a tall sight for the K98 rifles that also uses that "Euro. dovetail".
dju

[4 Scale]

Originally Posted by DavidJayUden

There is a tall sight for the K98 rifles that also uses that "Euro. dovetail".
dju

Perfect, found one on eBay for $9. It will be fun grinding it into a taller but fake 1900 Model front sight. My career as a "Luger Mechanic" is about to begin.

[DavidJayUden]

Hopefully, it will be a "LONG career".
dju

[4 Scale]

Originally Posted by DavidJayUden

Hopefully, it will be a "LONG career".
dju

Yes, at least 7mm "long".

If anyone gets on me for faking Luger parts I will blame you.