Luger Identification

I need some help identifing a Luger I own. It is clearly marked DWM on top of the toggle, under the barrel is a small crown with the letter N under it, serial #6421 (and all numbers seem to match on pistol), and a "O" with tails on it under the serial number. The barrel length is only appr. 3-13/16" from bolt face to end of barrel. The end of the frame has the full serial number and the modified "O", and Germany in very small letters. The safety lever has Gesichert marked on the frame. It has dark brown wooden grips and clip end(which also has Germany stamped in it). The crown & N is also found on the frame and toggle areas. The weapon cannot be cycled with the safety on and does have the hold open device. It is a 7.65 (.30 Luger) caliper. It has a lanard ring on rear of frame, no grip safety, but does have a stock lug. No markings over chamber area at all. Blueing and finish is appr. 90%, chamber and rifleing are in very good condition.

Any help in identifing and appr. value would be greatly helpful. I'm a very advid hunter and shooter, I love all guns of any type, but I really love any old guns. I got this wonderful piece with a Walther P-38 passed down to me from my father, the only scuttlebutt history I have is the they were supposed to have been brought back to the States by an uncle during WWII?

Thank you for any info you can provide!

[Johnny Peppers]

Sounds like you have what is commonly referred to as a '20 Commercial. These were manufactured in the 1920's following WWI, and the GERMANY stamp indicates it was made for export. They are really nice pistols, but have no great collectibility due to such large numbers being made and all virtually alike.

[Aaron]

Just a few words to clarify that your Luger was definitely not brought back from WWII. It was exported to the US and sold over the counter sometime in the 20's or 30's. It is a commercial pistol intended for private sales in this country. As for your P-38, I cannot say.

[Kyrie]

Hi Pete,


While I agree with Johnny that you have what collectors call a â??1920 Commercialâ?� variation, Iâ??ll have to respectfully disagree with the rest of his comments. 1920 Commercial Lugers are a collecting specialty all its own, and there are near infinite sub-variations to be found. In mint condition, the least valuable of these runs about $900 in value - and truly rare sub-variations may have a value in the thousands of dollars.


The 1920 Commercial you have is the most common sub-variation. At about 90% original blue, its value would be approximately in the $600 - $700 range.


Hope this helps!


Best regards,


Kyrie

Johnny,Aaron and Kyrie;

Thank you all very much for your quick and much appriciated responses. Your answers are sort of what I was thinking the Luger to be, but I also figure you all know a whole lot more about them than I do!(but I'm learning) so you confirmed my thoughts and then some. I make my best efforts to know all I can know about any firearm I own. I know most all there is to know about all my firearms except for the Luger and the P-38. Now I know a whole lot more about the Luger than I did, now I'll start researching the P-38. High monitary value was never a big deal for me, It was given to me by my Dad and I love all firearms, expensive or cheap in cost but not quality! I've never been able to sell a firearm I own yet, I still have every last one I've ever owned!


Thank you all again; Pete

[Johnny Peppers]

The pistol described by Paul is what 99% of Luger collectors call the '20 Commercial. If you want to lump the Army and Police pistols, the Swiss Commercials, A&F Commercials, the Stoeger Commercials, and the BKIW/Mauser Lugers into the '20 Commercial designation, then there is a large variation in '20 Commercials. I have yet to see an A&F or Stoeger referred to as a '20 Commercial.

Some even insist on calling the used military pistols sold in the US following WWI '20 Commercials. That adds even more variations.

[Marvin]

Pete,


The Luger Forum also has a Sister Forum, The P.38 Forum. You may want to visit that site and post information on the pistol and you can get more info on it. Just click on "P.38 Forum" and it will take you to the site. Once at the main site, click on the Discussion Forum.


Marvin



P.38 Forum

Thanks alot Marvin, I did just that with great results. Pete

[David Jackson]

I don't know a lot about this either; but if you look at Jan Still's book "Weimar and Early Nazi Lugers" and read about this period you might think you actually have a Weimar Alphabet SN DWM Luger.


That book indicates these were made from 1921 to 1928; short frame, stock lug, and no grip safety.

It also says, "Commercial, mostly 7.65 mm caliber, 3 5/8" barrel. Many marked "GERMANY". " The serial number (suffix) range is i,k,l,m,n,o,p,q, (which in the book's photo looks like an "o" with the right wing going up and the left wing going down) and r.

Apparently there are hundreds reported and estimated production is 75,600.


I have a similar gun, "k" suffix; although it has an American Eagle over the chamber, and is marked safe and loaded; indicating it was intended for sale in the United States.


I think Jan Still's books are excellent references on Lugers.


FWIW


David J.

Thanks for the info David, I'll see if I can locate a copy of this book, sounds like a great reference book to have.


Pete