Gun storage

[hayhugh]

I have been storing six lugers in a long gun case for ease of handling and viewing. Just reading in another posting that the egg foam is detrimental to the guns! First just what does the foam do to the guns? How about if I placed each in a gun sock and placed that back on the foam? Evidently plastic gun cases that guns usually come from the factory are not to be trusted what is the most used way of carefree storage? Thanks for all information...Hugh

[DonVoigt]

Hugh,
the chemicals in the foam start to degrade as soon as they are formed, especially if they are cheaply done. The by products of "decay" are what cause the damage.

Thick socks will help, so will frequent in and out to allow volatile chemicals to escape.

I would still not "store" them in the case, carry them around in it yes- but in socks.

IMO the "best" method of carefree storage is "unwrapped" in a safe with drier in place and the safe in a climate controlled environment. Pistols oiled and wiped down as usual, no heavy grease or other extra ordinary steps required.

[Robert in NC]

I will add that in the safe I make sure all my guns that are laying on something (as opposed to standing upright) are laying on a hard non-porous surface. I use plexiglass. I had several guns develop issues where the metal was in contact with the 'carpet' in the gunsafe.

[mrerick]

Foam rubber deterioration leaves a nasty sticky mess that often smells of ammonia and formalin and acetic acid.

I have made silicone impregnated gun sleeves out of the material used for thin sweat shirts. Some types of silicone can adhere to metal surfaces and are almost impossible to remove, so you have to be careful.

The silicone impregnated gun sleeves and socks are a good choice. Another is open air storage in a safe on a rack with dehumidification inside the safe. I like the sleeves and socks better because they provide some moisture repellent protection.

[hayhugh]

How about if I cover the foam with a linen sheet material? The foam might deteriorate, or crumble but it would not touch the gun. I really like the convenience of the long gun case for transporting and keeping the guns when underway during the summer.

[mrerick]

The vapors from the chemicals given off by foam deterioration will permeate any cloth you cover the foam with.

I personally store in silicone impregnated gun socks inside zippered gun rugs. Ditch the foam as a storage solution.

You'll be happy you did it now, and didn't wait until the damage starts.

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by hayhugh

How about if I cover the foam with a linen sheet material? The foam might deteriorate, or crumble but it would not touch the gun. I really like the convenience of the long gun case for transporting and keeping the guns when underway during the summer.

Transporting is fine, long term storage in foam not.

You have to give up a little convenience!

[gunbugs]

Over the years, I've had the opportunity, sad though it has been, to handle and sometimes refurbish guns that have been damaged from improper storage and/or house fires. A good fire resistant safe, with the guns in socks, and rugs or cases as well, is a good bet. Try to use something natural next to the gun, plastics, polyesters, or other synthetic materials will melt onto the gun and cause pretty serious damage. Layers are your friend. just like dressing for the cold. Layers of natural materials, such as cotton or wool, are fairly protective. Complete coverage is best, as any exposed area will most likely be smoke damaged. The smoke in most house fires, when mixed with the water they spray, will be acidic, and remove the finish in a hurry. As far as storage goes, keeping them dry is a must, and off the carpet. As has already been mentioned, carpet carries a variety of chemicals, some of which apparently are not gun friendly. I've handled guns that had the carpet "glued" to the side, from laying under the bed or couch for extended periods of time, and the finish has been heavily pitted. There may have been water involved as well, but who knows. Neglect will always catch up to you. The foam used in the cheap plastic cases, I'm sure, will deteriorate over time as well, and as has been mentioned, will gas out chemicals along the way. Most likely not good.

[Sergio Natali]

Egg foam and bubble wrap and holsters should never be taken into cosideration for storing a gun.

The best way to preserve any gun is to leave it clean and properly lubed in a dry safe, period.

[Sergio Natali]

If you really prefer to wrap your in something use wax paper and put it away in a dry place.

[Major Tom]

The shelves in my gun safe are plastic. I covered them with thin cork sheets mostly to keep my guns from getting marred by the hard plastic. So, is cork OK?

[George Anderson]

I store my pistols in a gun safe. The shelves are lined with a synthetic fabric. The Lugers stand on their heads with inventory tags hanging from the lanyard loops. The other pistols lay flat.

[Lugerdoc]

I must disagree with GUNBUGS, as most natural fabrics (cotton, wool, etc) are hydroscopic and will absorb moisture from a humid climate. So recommend either dry or greased (for long term) storage in a synthedic gun rug. TH

[4 Scale]

"Bore Stores" were recommended to me by an experienced collector. These claim to be made of a synthetic, non-hydroscopic fabric with a rust-inhibiting treatment of silicone and some other ingredient. I've used them for going on three years and they seem to work fine but the real question is how they do over longer periods.

There are a few topics about Lugers like best long-term storage, grip cleaning, lubricants that cry out for solid research. That is because all we really have is collector anecdotes like the one I just posted. Luger metals and finishes and grips are reasonably tough so of course lots of stuff works, or seems to, for lots of collectors. I am happy to report my personal experience that none of my Lugers have disintegrated when placed in a Bore Store, or my favorite lube is used, or my favorite grip cleaning/preservation strategy is used. But I would prefer data from an expert.

[Curly1]

I have been using Bore stores on all my guns for years they do the job well.

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by 4 Scale

"Bore Stores" were recommended to me by an experienced collector. These claim to be made of a synthetic, non-hydroscopic fabric with a rust-inhibiting treatment of silicone and some other ingredient. I've used them for going on three years and they seem to work fine but the real question is how they do over longer periods.

There are a few topics about Lugers like best long-term storage, grip cleaning, lubricants that cry out for solid research. That is because all we really have is collector anecdotes like the one I just posted. Luger metals and finishes and grips are reasonably tough so of course lots of stuff works, or seems to, for lots of collectors. I am happy to report my personal experience that none of my Lugers have disintegrated when placed in a Bore Store, or my favorite lube is used, or my favorite grip cleaning/preservation strategy is used. But I would prefer data from an expert.

You can become the storage expert! Why not?
Only problem is you will have to risk many collectibles in various storage arrangements/materials for many years- so maybe a two generation challenge?

You do know the definition of an "expert" right? Someone over 50 miles from home.

Or use common sense , I've been storing weapons for over 55 years, and I know what works for me- as do many others.
And we have all seen storage "disasters", most relating to stupidity and laziness.

I get very amused reading posts about storage and what to do- it is just very elementary(protect from moisture and chemicals) and all the above posts hit on various elements that contribute to "safe" storage. JMHO

[4 Scale]

I don't trust my common sense when it comes to material properties. As an example, in this thread I see numerous collectors saying "don't store in foam". I think that is good general advice.

But - I have metal photo equipment that has been stored in foam-lined Pelican cases for decades. Pelican in a high quality case manufacturer. It looks like 'egg foam' BTW. I have never had a metal item in a Pelican case corrode, or seen the foam in them degrade.

I have heard that polyethylene foam is safe for long term storage. I think polyethylene foam is my Pelicans, but I'm not sure (they are decades old). On the other hand, I have had foam that crumbled after a few years. There seem to be many types of foam. What is the difference between them? Is it OK to store firearms in Pelican cases? I would guess so based on decades of experience but the truth is I don't know because I am not a materials expert.

One highly experienced collector says sweat shirt material can be used to make cases. My sweat shirts are 100% cotton. Several others say only synthetics should be used. Who is right?

I'd not pushing Pelican, nor am I criticizing fellow collectors or disputing the advice in the thread not to store firearms in foam. I am just pointing out that in this thread there are conflicts between collector experience. There are a huge amount of storage products out there, and I wish I knew more about them via an expert impartial source. Like probably many collectors, some of my Lugers are over 100 years old. I can tell you that based on inspection under a microscope, even the +90% blue ones have oxidation. What is the best way to prevent oxidation? I wish I knew, based on data.

[gunbugs]

Originally Posted by Lugerdoc

I must disagree with GUNBUGS, as most natural fabrics (cotton, wool, etc) are hydroscopic and will absorb moisture from a humid climate. So recommend either dry or greased (for long term) storage in a synthedic gun rug. TH

In interior Alaska, where I'm at, humidity really isn't a problem. I can understand the concern in more humid areas in the world. Up here it is classified as a subarctic desert. My concern is a lot of synthetics will melt onto the gun during a house fire. That makes a pretty evil mess of things. But, in the end, we does what we do. As Calvin would say.

[wlyon]

All my firearms are in a vault (room) we had built with the house. The door to the room is from an old Idaho bank. I don't worry about storage and have never had a problem in 60+ years. I do put a liberal coating of good old 3 in 1 oil inside and out. I give them a good cleaning once a year. More for fun than functional. I never store in holsters or cases of any kind. We all have different methods. If it works for you and has for years keep it up. Too many variables to have one surefire method. Bill

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by 4 Scale

I don't trust my common sense when it comes to material properties. As an example, in this thread I see numerous collectors saying "don't store in foam". I think that is good general advice.

But - I have metal photo equipment that has been stored in foam-lined Pelican cases for decades. Pelican in a high quality case manufacturer. It looks like 'egg foam' BTW. I have never had a metal item in a Pelican case corrode, or seen the foam in them degrade.

I have heard that polyethylene foam is safe for long term storage. I think polyethylene foam is my Pelicans, but I'm not sure (they are decades old). On the other hand, I have had foam that crumbled after a few years. There seem to be many types of foam. What is the difference between them? Is it OK to store firearms in Pelican cases? I would guess so based on decades of experience but the truth is I don't know because I am not a materials expert.

One highly experienced collector says sweat shirt material can be used to make cases. My sweat shirts are 100% cotton. Several others say only synthetics should be used. Who is right?

I'd not pushing Pelican, nor am I criticizing fellow collectors or disputing the advice in the thread not to store firearms in foam. I am just pointing out that in this thread there are conflicts between collector experience. There are a huge amount of storage products out there, and I wish I knew more about them via an expert impartial source. Like probably many collectors, some of my Lugers are over 100 years old. I can tell you that based on inspection under a microscope, even the +90% blue ones have oxidation. What is the best way to prevent oxidation? I wish I knew, based on data.

Not to sound "smart, short, or snarky", but the only way to prevent oxidation is to store oxidize-able material in a nitrogen atmosphere or a vacuum. Or perhaps submerged in paraffin oil which is used to store highly flammable metallic sodium, so it is pretty much moisture free- but a little bit messy.

You don't need data to reach this conclusion, only a basic understanding of the chemical process involved; in this case oxidation of iron.

Any other other achievable storage condition allows slow oxidation, or fast depending on the specific condition.

Yes- there are "grades of foam " and foams of different chemical composition. Stability of foam is primarily dictated by how carefully they are created- i.e. they must use the correct and exact chemical balance of foam base and initiator. This almost never happens, but the better control the better the stability and thus the life of the foam.

It is great that your photo equipment has survived in foam, I have seen much foam that has deteriorated, enough so I would never store anything in foam for more than a few weeks without inspection. It is great for carrying stuff from place to place.

But why store stuff in a material that will cause a problem a certain percentage of the time.

Synthetic or natural materials don't matter a lot, it is the atmosphere the object is stored in and the temperature.

How often one inspects, cleans, oils, etc. is also quite important in assuring long term storage.

If you want facts, study the methods used by the US Army for preserving weapons. I'm sure they studied the heck out of the problem, as for them it was a really big issue.Them having to store and attempt to preserve everything from small arms to battleship rifles!

Excuse me but my chemical training is showing.

This is not a hard question to answer, keep them dry and look at them occasionally.