Killing mold on holsters and preservation

[grantman]

Fellows (esp. Jerry B.)

1. What is the latest and greatest on mold killing? Is it heat....then acetone cleaning....then Connolly's Hide Care?:

2. Where do you folks stand on the old Connolly's "Hide Food" vs. the new Connolly's "Hide Care" controversy.

3. Are there any opinions regarding a pure lanolin type dressing, such as Tandy's "Dr. Jackson's Hide Rejuvenator"?

I have read that the British Museum at one time dipped the entire leather piece in acetone to kill what was described as "fungus" and then dressed with a "lanolin" dressing. The item was then buffed by hand.

[DonVoigt]

There are several threads on these issues/questions.

A search would likely bring them up; if I recall correctly, one or more is a "sticky".

[George Anderson]

I have found Ballistol to be effective.

[Mrgunguy]

In the past I’ve cleaned off the particulate matter with warm water and then left the holster out in the direct sunlight for as long as I could. I then wipe it down with acetone and treat it with the old Connolly’s. It seems to work pretty good. Only once have I had to do it again because of a little bit coming back.

Good luck! Mold is a bear to get rid of.

[Edward Tinker]

Just remember - in my opinion, that not all museum practices are designed to preserve, but make things pretty. Sometimes items are preserved as found, sometimes cleaned up and sometimes what makes it look best.

[lugerholsterrepair]

OMG!!!! In the past I’ve cleaned off the particulate matter with warm water and then left the holster out in the direct sunlight for as long as I could. I then wipe it down with acetone and treat it with the old Connolly’s. It seems to work pretty good. Only once have I had to do it again because of a little bit coming back.

WATER? Is the WORST thing on Planet Earth to put on ANY vintage leather! WARM water is WORSE than WATER!!! Then direct sunlight? This would be like pouring SALT on a garden slug! DO NOT DO THIS!!! EVER!!!

[grantman]

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

OMG!!!! In the past I’ve cleaned off the particulate matter with warm water and then left the holster out in the direct sunlight for as long as I could. I then wipe it down with acetone and treat it with the old Connolly’s. It seems to work pretty good. Only once have I had to do it again because of a little bit coming back.

WATER? Is the WORST thing on Planet Earth to put on ANY vintage leather! WARM water is WORSE than WATER!!! Then direct sunlight? This would be like pouring SALT on a garden slug! DO NOT DO THIS!!! EVER!!!

Jerry: I'm with you on the water issue. IS the best method the one I described above: dry heat....acetone....Connolly's?

212F, or 350f for 5 minutes, slow cool?

[grantman]

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

There are several threads on these issues/questions.

A search would likely bring them up; if I recall correctly, one or more is a "sticky".

Don: I have read the existing threads and I'm wondering if anyone's methods have been changed or improved.

[Mrgunguy]

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

WATER? Is the WORST thing on Planet Earth to put on ANY vintage leather! WARM water is WORSE than WATER!!! Then direct sunlight? This would be like pouring SALT on a garden slug! DO NOT DO THIS!!! EVER!!!

First, let me be clear that I’ve never had any vintage leather that was moldy (perhaps I should have been more clear on that point). The only moldy holsters I’ve ever had were ones that got that way from being left wet to begin with, like during re-enactments or camping/hiking. And then I only use water enough to get the visible garbage off. I’m not soaking them in it for crying out loud.

Second, sunlight is an extremely effective natural method of killing mold (and viruses for that matter) so long as it’s not left out too long. About four hours or so is the usual and seems to do the trick. The acetone is minimal and just backs up what the sun did.

All of my old leather is kept in a dry, dark box in a closet. They never get mold, mildew or any other nastiness on them. If I have a holster that is valuable and in need of help, I send it to Jerry Burney.

[lugerholsterrepair]

OK, The best approach is to do as Don says..search out the thousands of words already written.

First off you need to determine IF it's mold and what type it is. Some molds are grey dried and not affected by heat. I don't know if this type is alive or dried & dead? An active living growing mold will be white and greasy feeling. This is the best for heat treatment. Heat will make it disappear inside and out. Even fairly mild heat.

I have a solar hotbox I use. Plexiglas top and achieves 150-220+ on a hot sunny Yuma day. Metal gets hot enough to make you drop it. It will erase most living mold flowers.

BUT! Will it kill the spores? Maybe not. I use the 350 F treatment to pretty much guarantee deep heat penetration for a killing dose. Heat your Wife's kitchen oven to 350. Place holster/or other leather on cookie sheet, place in oven, Sing Happy Birthday a couple of times and TURN OVEN OFF! You are then free to leave the area but NOT BEFORE YOU TURN THE OVEN OFF! After you YOU TURN THE OVEN OFF come back after an hour or two or even later. The oven will naturally lose heat and finally cool. Because you what? YOU TURNED THE OVEN OFF! Now if you forget to TURN THE OVEN OFF you will come back because the smoke detectors will be telling you to. Remember the old movie, Fahrenheit 451? Well, that's a neat reminder of when paper bursts into flame. Well, at 350 your holster won't burst into flame but at that sustained temperature, long term, it WILL toast, smoke and brown off eventually shriveling up into a twisted charred wreck.

OH! One other IMPORTANT tidbit! DO NOT cover the leather with ANYTHING! Leave it to the open air. Let it breathe and expel moisture. If you cover it, it will become a boiled shriveled twisted shrunken ...GOD! It's too horrible! Don't do it.

But it's possible lessor temperatures work about as well.


OK, Lets talk about acetone..Tandy sells it in a small bottle labled 'Leather cleaner" but it's acetone. Acetone CAN damage suede. The fuzzy stuff on the underneath. I've seen it eat it away and harden, stain the hell out of it. So I am careful when/where I use it. On surface leather it seems benign.

Rubbing/medical Alcohol is the best I know of. It will not damage leather that I know of. Remember the leather you might be heating up and slopping Ballistol/OIL, or other chemicals on is likely many decades older than you might be. THINK, investigate, research before you put it on cause once on it's there to stay.

[grantman]

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

OK, The best approach is to do as Don says..search out the thousands of words already written.

First off you need to determine IF it's mold and what type it is. Some molds are grey dried and not affected by heat. I don't know if this type is alive or dried & dead? An active living growing mold will be white and greasy feeling. This is the best for heat treatment. Heat will make it disappear inside and out. Even fairly mild heat.

I have a solar hotbox I use. Plexiglas top and achieves 150-220+ on a hot sunny Yuma day. Metal gets hot enough to make you drop it. It will erase most living mold flowers.

BUT! Will it kill the spores? Maybe not. I use the 350 F treatment to pretty much guarantee deep heat penetration for a killing dose. Heat your Wife's kitchen oven to 350. Place holster/or other leather on cookie sheet, place in oven, Sing Happy Birthday a couple of times and TURN OVEN OFF! You are then free to leave the area but NOT BEFORE YOU TURN THE OVEN OFF! After you YOU TURN THE OVEN OFF come back after an hour or two or even later. The oven will naturally lose heat and finally cool. Because you what? YOU TURNED THE OVEN OFF! Now if you forget to TURN THE OVEN OFF you will come back because the smoke detectors will be telling you to. Remember the old movie, Fahrenheit 451? Well, that's a neat reminder of when paper bursts into flame. Well, at 350 your holster won't burst into flame but at that sustained temperature, long term, it WILL toast, smoke and brown off eventually shriveling up into a twisted charred wreck.

OH! One other IMPORTANT tidbit! DO NOT cover the leather with ANYTHING! Leave it to the open air. Let it breathe and expel moisture. If you cover it, it will become a boiled shriveled twisted shrunken ...GOD! It's too horrible! Don't do it.

But it's possible lessor temperatures work about as well.


OK, Lets talk about acetone..Tandy sells it in a small bottle labled 'Leather cleaner" but it's acetone. Acetone CAN damage suede. The fuzzy stuff on the underneath. I've seen it eat it away and harden, stain the hell out of it. So I am careful when/where I use it. On surface leather it seems benign.

Rubbing/medical Alcohol is the best I know of. It will not damage leather that I know of. Remember the leather you might be heating up and slopping Ballistol/OIL, or other chemicals on is likely many decades older than you might be. THINK, investigate, research before you put it on cause once on it's there to stay.

Jerry: That's what I was wondering....It is common for methods used by museums to evolve over time, and data accumulation. Hence my phraseology.

[Sergio Natali]

I realize that it may appear too simplistic but I've always cleaned all my leather holsters only with BALLISTOL and a clean cloth.
After so many years I still have them all in very good shape.

[lugerholsterrepair]

YES, IT DOES SEEM TOO SIMPLISTIC WHEN IN ACTUALITY IT IS NOTHING OF THE SORT. Ballistol is a PENETRATING OIL. A REPELLENT of air & moisture. Your vintage holsters will become an oil soaked rag and PLEASE! read to the bottom! The Ballistol web site says DON'T USE IT ON LEATHER! Like ANY oil it will eventually harden and burn, acting like the leather has been charred in a fire.



Ballistol contains medicinal grade mineral oil, alkaline salts of oleic acid, several alcohols, Benzyl Acetate and an oil from vegetal seeds. The mineral oil is unchlorinated and conforms to the specifications of US Pharmacopeia XX. As an aerosol Ballistol contains 33.8% VOCs. As a non-aerosol it contains 5.3% VOCs.


Ballistol lubricates, penetrates, cleans, protects and preserves metal, plastic, rubber and wood. Ballistol is an outstanding penetrating oil, creeps into the finest cracks, and loosens nuts and bolts. It can also be used as a cutting/boring oil.


Of course, Ballistol can do whatever other lubricants/protectants can do. Use it on tight or squeaky hinges, on door locks, padlocks, for the maintenance of gardening tools, lawn mowers, scissors, pocket knives, as sharpening oil, on bicycles, motorcycles, your model train, skateboards or roller blades, ski bindings and edges, etc., etc. But Ballistol does more. It can be used to polish silver and brass. And it will even protect WET surfaces.

Can I use Ballistol on suede?

Do not use Ballistol on suede. Ballistol can stiffen suede. FROM THE BALLISTOL WEB SITE!!!


Gentlemen, I am not happy to inform you of what seems disagreeable and counter to your practices but in the interest of preservation it would be my advice to STOP using or NEVER start using this penetrating oil or ANY oil on vintage holsters.

[Proofed]

Water to clean mold is like ringing the dinner bell and hollering "come and get it" then sitting back and watching the mold feeding frenzy. And if you only use it sparingly its even worse, mold don't eat much. And if there is none to begin with the dinner bells still a ringin.

I use Ballistol on ever pistol I own I swear by it, however I would never put it on a holster or any other leather I own.

I think of cleaning leather like dry cleaning, the object is to use an agent to clean however the agent must be very quick to evaporate like acetone etc. 10 minutes later its gone. Using any type of oil will be there 10 years later and will most likely not be the same composition as when it was applied, and at that point after it has soaked in if you feel the need to remove it, you probable cant.
Only clean the surface and only treat the surface
JMO

[Sergio Natali]

[QUOTE=lugerholsterrepair;331228]YES, IT DOES SEEM TOO SIMPLISTIC WHEN IN ACTUALITY IT IS NOTHING OF THE SORT. Ballistol is a PENETRATING OIL. A REPELLENT of air & moisture. Your vintage holsters will become an oil soaked rag and PLEASE! read to the bottom! The Ballistol web site says DON'T USE IT ON LEATHER! Like ANY oil it will eventually harden and burn, acting like the leather has been charred in a fire.



At this point I suppose the BALLISTOL you can find in the States is not like the one we use here in Europe, I can confirm that I 've been using it for decades also on wood and vintage leather holsters, but obviously not on suede, and they are exactly as they were in the first place.
I enclose a link where BALLISTOL oil is advised also on leather.

https://ballistol.de/shop/en/product...rsal-oil?c=192

[lugerholsterrepair]

Sergio, Like all efforts at preservation of valuable historical artifacts there are differences of opinion and methods of execution to achieve the desired results. Ballistol is first & foremost a penetrating oil. Penetrating oils "penetrate" from front to back, one side to the other. You ARE putting it on the suede, know it or not. The Ballistol website says don't do it, the leather will harden. I have observed all kinds of leather holsters for decades with JUST THIS problem. These holsters are from 80 to 100+ years old. I suspect it takes time to do what Ballistol does and you are a young man. It may be that the damage you are inflicting will not even show up in your lifetime. But Ballistol says it will and I say it will eventually cause problems that they would not see if it were not for the application of a
penetrating oil.

We all make choices. I try to make informed choices. Each to their own.

[George Anderson]

Like Sergio, I have used Ballistol on holsters to treat mold and have found that it works perfectly with no residue or other ill effects.

[lugerholsterrepair]

From the link Sergio kindly provided.. Ballistol effectively protect leather against getting hard and dry, " your vegetable tanned molded & formed Luger holsters are SUPPOSED to and STAY hard & dry. " ONLY the VERY surface NEEDS anything and that doesn't happen with a PENETRATING OIL!"
against water, " AGAINST WATER? Yes, oil & water don't mix. insects and fungi. Residues of tannic acid in leather will be neutralized dry leather softens and gets elastic again " Softens! LISTEN to what Ballistols says! Softens! "with a dull shine bright leather can get darker "can and WILL get darker because it's PENETRATING OIL!" typically the smell of ballistol will evaporate quickly there will be no greasy film "Not greasy because it will be oil soaked." on the leather.
I won't beat this donkey any further.

[Sieger]

[QUOTE=Sergio Natali;331265]

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

YES, IT DOES SEEM TOO SIMPLISTIC WHEN IN ACTUALITY IT IS NOTHING OF THE SORT. Ballistol is a PENETRATING OIL. A REPELLENT of air & moisture. Your vintage holsters will become an oil soaked rag and PLEASE! read to the bottom! The Ballistol web site says DON'T USE IT ON LEATHER! Like ANY oil it will eventually harden and burn, acting like the leather has been charred in a fire.



At this point I suppose the BALLISTOL you can find in the States is not like the one we use here in Europe, I can confirm that I 've been using it for decades also on wood and vintage leather holsters, but obviously not on suede, and they are exactly as they were in the first place.
I enclose a link where BALLISTOL oil is advised also on leather.

https://ballistol.de/shop/en/product...rsal-oil?c=192

Sergio,

The USA Ballistol IS EXACTLY the original German formula you have in Europe.

The German Army used it, through 1945, on wood, leather goods and for gun cleaning; as it was designed and formulated to do just that.

To date, I have found nothing better!!


Sieger

[Sieger]

Originally Posted by lugerholsterrepair

From the link Sergio kindly provided.. Ballistol effectively protect leather against getting hard and dry, " your vegetable tanned molded & formed Luger holsters are SUPPOSED to and STAY hard & dry. " ONLY the VERY surface NEEDS anything and that doesn't happen with a PENETRATING OIL!"
against water, " AGAINST WATER? Yes, oil & water don't mix. insects and fungi. Residues of tannic acid in leather will be neutralized dry leather softens and gets elastic again " Softens! LISTEN to what Ballistols says! Softens! "with a dull shine bright leather can get darker "can and WILL get darker because it's PENETRATING OIL!" typically the smell of ballistol will evaporate quickly there will be no greasy film "Not greasy because it will be oil soaked." on the leather.
I won't beat this donkey any further.

Jerry,

What are your thoughts regarding Neetsfoot Oil?

Sieger