Need information

[F4phantom]

I received the Luger from my uncle. He brought it back from WWII. He was in a tank battalion and they were going to destroy a number of weapons. They were told to grab souvenirs if they wanted them. He got the Luger, a Mauser 9mm rifle, a Mauser 1934 pistol and holster, a couple of French shotguns (engraved), a doeskin pack and other paraphernalia.
The pistol is not in real good condition. Probably classified as a shooter. That's okay since it has personal meaning to me.
I would like to get more information about it. The serial number, 556, seems a bit low to me. All the parts match except for the magazine.
Any info would be appreciated.
OOPS -- pictures added

[mrerick]

Hi Jim and welcome to the forum.

Looks like you have a (make that 1913) DWM 9mm Luger, proofed and accepted for the German military at the end of WW-I, and used thorugh WW-II when it got the magazine you have mounted in it.

The flash photography makes it impossible to judge the finish. It looks like it may be oxidizing and pitting. You would do well to stabilize it. Carefully remove the grips. Do not lift the left one off the frame, but rather lift it slightly and slide it down to remove it. Same with the right. You can easily chip the left grip. Use the right size bit to remove the screws, and don't lose them - they have a very specific profile and are hard to find.

Use 0000 fine steel or bronze wool well oiled on a well oiled surface, and gently remove the red oxide present. I'd disassembly the pistol and inspect it.

If it's all matching, and pitting has not damaged it extensively, it would likely be considered collectible.

The pistol's serial number is on the front of the frame above the trigger guard, and should have numeric digits over a suffix letter (which is part of the serial number).

We publish a FAQ document you'll find useful. Just follow the FAQ links at the top of every page.

Any specific questions?

Marc

[F4phantom]

Originally Posted by mrerick

Hi Jim and welcome to the forum.

Looks like you have a 1918 DWM 9mm Luger, proofed and accepted for the German military at the end of WW-I, and used thorugh WW-II when it got the magazine you have mounted in it.
Marc

If it is a 1918 DWM why does it say 1913 on the top strap. The serial number on the frame above the trigger guard is 556. I'll try to get better pictures today.

[spacecoast]

You're right... it's 1913 and has no stock lug... that's good as there were only about 25,000 made. Does the serial number have a suffix below it?

[Vlim]

Its hard to see on the photo, but the manufacturing year is 1913.

These pistols were numbered in blocks of 10,000 followed by a letter of the alphabet after the first 10,000.

Look for a script letter below the serial on the frame.

[Doubs]

Your 1913 Luger was made without a hold open to retain the toggle train in the open position when the last shot was fired. It was later modified to have a hold open as indicated by the small pin in the frame just above and behind the trigger. There is a crown/letter stamp just below the pin put there to show that the modification was done. When the hold open became a standard factory feature, the pin was no longer visible on the outside.

The 1913 early production guns - like yours - were without a stock lug but part way through production the lug was added as a standard feature. The quality of the 1913 Lugers was top drawer.

[Lugerdoc]

The stock lug first appeared on Erfurt made PO8s in mid-1913, but don't recall seeing them on DWM lugers until 1914. TH

[Doubs]

Originally Posted by Lugerdoc

The stock lug first appeared on Erfurt made PO8s in mid-1913, but don't recall seeing them on DWM lugers until 1914. TH

The military agreed on 4 August, 1913, that all military P.08 frames would thereafter be made with the stock lug. I don't know exactly when DWM began production of frames with the stock lugs but it was during late 1913 production.

[rpbcps]

Originally Posted by Doubs

The military agreed on 4 August, 1913, that all military P.08 frames would thereafter be made with the stock lug. I don't know exactly when DWM began production of frames with the stock lugs but it was during late 1913 production.

That is a nice pistol, no doubt there were many 'bring backs' in Britain once upon a time. However, with the fear of a Bolshevik revolution in the Britain, (and much of Europe), following the first world war, the UK firearms act of 1920 was introduced. that began our 'slippery slope' to complete gun control and eventual ban on private ownership of handguns.

Would I be right to say that the introduction of the Lange Pistole Model 1908, (LP08), which was approved for issue fitted with stock lugs, coincided with the introduction of stock lugs on all army luger frames? Makes sense it would have simplified production with the war looming, so standardisation all the army luger frames with all of them being fitted with stock lugs, would have done that.

[Doubs]

Originally Posted by rpbcps

Would I be right to say that the introduction of the Lange Pistole Model 1908, (LP08), which was approved for issue fitted with stock lugs, coincided with the introduction of stock lugs on all army luger frames? Makes sense it would have simplified production with the war looming, so standardisation all the army luger frames with all of them being fitted with stock lugs, would have done that.

Development of the LP-08 began in 1912. By 1913, after adoption of the LP-08, DWM was making four different frame forgings which complicated manufacture. Even though the stock lug required additional machining steps, the order on 4 August, 1913, to provide the stock lug on all future Army Lugers eliminated a big headache for DWM and made manufacture of a single frame for both LP-08 and short barrel Lugers for the Army possible.

While it wasn't exactly simultaneous with the LP-08, the adoption of the stock lug on all Army Lugers was likely influenced heavily by it and the simplification of manufacture made the decision easy.

[wlyon]

The stock lug appeared on 1913 DWM's somewhere around serial number 4000b. I have a 1913 DWM Serial # 4012 b with stock lug. Bill

[spangy]

Thanks for showing us your Luger F4phantom

I find this gun very fascinating and would love to own it ... be sure to thank your uncle because he's done you a solid.

[Sergio Natali]

Nice heirloom to keep and preserve.

If I were you I would disassemble it, then I would give it a good BALLISTOL or KROIL bath, after that clean every part with an old toothbrush and some clean cotton cloth.

[F4phantom]

I have included hopefully slightly better photos. The serial number has no letter suffix. There is a small symbol on the receiver but assume this to be an inspection mark. Also on the inside of the butt is a symbol and the number "9", again I think this is an inspectors mark.
My uncle passed 25 years ago and I did thank him before he was gone.

[Vlim]

Looks like it has a police magazine from the late 1930s. Can you do photos of the magazine and it's bottom?

No suffix means it was in the first block of 10,000 for that year.

[F4phantom]

Originally Posted by Vlim

Looks like it has a police magazine from the late 1930s. Can you do photos of the magazine and it's bottom?

No suffix means it was in the first block of 10,000 for that year.

The magazine is not original. Like so many pistols used during the war you got a magazine any where you can.
I fired the pistol sometime around 1969 and field stripped it then. I put it away and it has been wrapped up since then, 51 years. However I'm a lot older and have forgotten how to take it apart. I need to be directed to a reasonably good YouTube on the care and feeding of the beast.
Thank you to all who have responded to this post. I have found that you get more information this way than trying to do all the searches on the net. I appreciate it.
Jim S

[lugerholsterrepair]

A gentle scrubbing with 0000 steel wool dipped in oil will make your pistol look better. Knoxks off the rust crumbles.

[Heinz]

F4, the trick to taking it apart after you make sure it is unloaded (the luger upper is completely capable of firing when when off the frame) is to push back on the barrel so the toggle lugs just contact the the frame ears, and pull the assembly disconnect lever into a 90 degree down position. Remove the side plate and then you can slide the upper forward off the lower frame. pushing the upper back relieves the spring pressure on the disconnect lever.

[F4phantom]

Originally Posted by Heinz

F4, the trick to taking it apart after you make sure it is unloaded (the luger upper is completely capable of firing when when off the frame) is to push back on the barrel so the toggle lugs just contact the the frame ears, and pull the assembly disconnect lever into a 90 degree down position. Remove the side plate and then you can slide the upper forward off the lower frame. pushing the upper back relieves the spring pressure on the disconnect lever.

I did a search of YouTube and found a couple of videos that appear to make the job somewhat uncomplicated.
I noticed from your avatar that you have a Mauser 1934. The other pistol that was given to me by my uncle was a Mauser 1934. It has the original holster and extra magazine. The only marringis from the pistol rubbing agonist the holster.

[Heinz]

Nice 1934 Mauser. The one I posted is a 1914 with imperial army acceptance stamp