1929 Swiss Luger ?

Dean762 · 11-07-2004, 05:48 PM

Hello folks. I am considering picking up a 1929 Swiss(brown grip) to go with a WW2 Ord 40 Swiss uniform that I will eventually put together. I have seen them at FGS and simpsons. The ones at FGS just look a little to good and I suspect they have been rearsenaled. The one at simpsons looks all original but a bit more expensive and I dont know if it comes with a holster as do the FGS guns. Any thoughts or recommendations? I really want one of these guns but Im not sure which way to turn at this point. Thanks for any help.

Pete Ebbink · 11-07-2004, 06:47 PM

Hi Dean,

As I have all three M1929 Bern lugers (red, brown, and black); I cannot discourage any luger collector from picking up a M1929. But I might be biased.

If you are planning to only buy one M1929; I think the red-plastic ones are the most desirable and may yield a bit more investmemt return when you are ready to sell it in the future.

If you can find out the serial number of the brown M1929 luger you are considering, let us know and we can check a couple of Swiss luger books to make sure your serial number is "correct" to have brown plastic grips and magazine bottom.

The red canevasit plastic was quite fragile and brittle...and many have been replaced with the more common brown and/or black plastic parts.

If your serial number places your luger in the proper range for red plastic but now has brown plastic...it might be harder to resell in the future. If your serial number places the gun you are considering squarely in the proper serial number range for brown, you will not need to explain this in the future to prospective buyers and/or other collectors.

I think a nice, original finished brown M1929 Swiss luger would sell in the $ 1600-1900 USD price range...maybe a bit higher with dealers than private parties...

M1929 Swiss holsters are pretty easy to find here in the USA or even in Switzerland...range is from $ 75 to $ 200 depending on condition. Buying a holster and pistol from a dealer will probably cost you more than just buying the luger and finding a holster on your own...

I have worked with both the FGS folks and the Simspon folks. If you send emails letting them know you only want a factory original finished piece and not a Bern rework; they will usually give you their honest opinions in writing about a piece you might be interested. This written reply would be your documentaion trail in case, for some reason, you do not like the piece when you open the box and you return the gun...might help then with which party pays for shipping one or both ways...

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Dean762 · 11-07-2004, 08:50 PM

Thanks for this great info Pete. It really helps. I will let you know what I come up with. Are there any telltale signs or marks of a Bern rework? I know the K31 was marked with the year on the tang that it was repaired or rebuilt. anything similar on Lugers?

Lugerdoc · 11-08-2004, 10:51 AM

Dean, Since the Swiss and Dutch both had regular refurbishment programs in place, IMHO one of their lugers that has been ARSENAL refinished, does not lessen its value as much as one refinshed here in the states. Generally an arsenal job is difficult to detect, other than the marking being a bit "soft". TH

Dean762 · 11-09-2004, 05:30 AM

Thanks LugerDoc. Pete, what would the correct serial # range be for brown plastic grips and mag bottoms?

The best!
Dean

John Sabato · 11-09-2004, 10:32 AM

Dean, if you are interested in Swiss Lugers and you don't own Vittorio Bobba's book on them. That should be your first purchase... I know a local place that has one for $125.00... I can pick it up for you if you want... Same price, plus what ever it costs for me to ship it... just let me know.

Dean762 · 11-09-2004, 11:31 AM

You are right John. Thanks. I do need that book. I know simpsons has/had them. Havent checked the prices though.

Dean762 · 11-09-2004, 07:44 PM

Would the 633xx ser range qualify for the brown grips on the 1929? I did order the Parabellum book today. Probably get it in a week or so.

Pete Ebbink · 11-09-2004, 09:38 PM

Hi Dean,

A serial # 63xxx would certainly be well into the "brown" plastic...

From the info. presented in V. Bobba's book and a few other books, here is the color vs. serial number ranges (Please note the cut-over dates and/or serial numbers are not firm and some overlap occurs) :

# 50001 to # 57000 - Red plastic in years 1933-39

# 57000 to # 65000 - Brown plastic in years 1939-42

# 65000 to end (~ # 77941) - Black plastic in years 1942-46

In the commercial range (i.e. P25xxx series) :

# P25000 to # P25300 - Red plastic

# P25301 to # P25800 - Brown plastic

# P25801 to # P26600 and # P77941 to # P78258 - Black plastic

Regards,

Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

Dean762 · 11-09-2004, 10:59 PM

Pete your the best. This really helps.

Thanks
Dean

Lugerdoc · 11-10-2004, 09:28 AM

For any one needing brown plastic bottomed M29 Swiss mags, I still have a few like new ones available @$75 each, also spare Brown swiss cross marked bottoms separately, exc @$25 or G @$10 and one set of unused Black M29 grips @$50. Finally, I have one unused M29 7.65x120 original M29 barrel available @$250 plus many other Swiss marked luger parts. TH

Dean762 · 11-11-2004, 12:23 AM

LugerDoc put me down for one mag. Maybe another one later. I have a 1929 coming in next week and want to be sure I like it before buying extras. You can contact me at [email protected] if you like.

Thanks
Dean

Dean762 · 11-11-2004, 02:12 AM

By the way guys. Any good suggestions on where to pick up some 7.65/30 luger ammo? I know Fiocchi makes it. Anyone else?

Steve Richards · 11-12-2004, 01:36 AM

Dean,

Check the Shooting and Reloading section. There is an active thread about .30 ammo.

Steve

Lugerdoc · 11-12-2004, 10:22 AM

Dean, Just let me know when you are ready for a mag. I also have a good supply of Fiocchi berdan primed 30 luger ammo @$25/box of 50 or I may also have a few boxes of more easily reloadable, boxer primed Winchester or Remington @$30/bx. TH

StirThePot · 01-04-2005, 06:50 PM

Just bought a case of Fiocchi .30 Luger from Graf & Sons, Mexico, MO.

funfree · 01-30-2005, 07:06 AM

http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0121.jpg
Yeahh i bought it yesterday for 1000 swiss francs. I'm swiss and I live in switzerland. This swiss parabellum 06/29 is in a very good condition and rarely used. The barrel is also in very good condition. The gunnummer is 59483 produced august 1940.
http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0130.jpg
There is no refinish or something. Well thats my first luger in my collection. As a swiss citizien swiss luger are not so expensive to buy in my country. Around 900-1300 swiss francs for Luger 06/29 depend which quality you want. This is my sechond swiss army pistol. Now in the swiss army i use the armypistol p 75 (SigP220 9mm)
Well I hope you see the photos clearly. This forum is really informative.
Ohh sorry i forget the holster for this parabellum here is it.
http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0108.jpg
The Holster is from A.TRACHSEL
40
LEISSIGEN

I`m quite happy now. I saw in germany 06/29 in this condition like mine you have to pay around 1000 Euro (ca. 1500 swiss francs) or more if you want to buy one.

Pete Ebbink · 01-30-2005, 08:36 PM

Hi Alex,

Thanks for posting your photos of your M1929 Bern luger and holster. Congratulations on a very nice rig purchase.

Prices in the USA for a brown Bern 1929 luger and holster would be closer to $ 1800-2000 USD...

Regards,

Pete...

funfree · 01-30-2005, 09:32 PM

I didn't know that my swiss luger 06/29 would be so expensive in the USA. I was such a lucky boy. I bought it by a private person (this kind for gunsale is allowed in switzerland by law). The former possesor explained me he bought this pistol once 15 years ago from an old former swiss army officier. The former officier almost never used this swiss luger in the army. This Parabellum is in a superb condition for collecting. The man who sold me the gun told me that. This swiss luger 06/29 is really for me in a excellent orginal finish and makes me feel really happy about it. I think the price of 1000 swiss francs was a good one for this quality. This was a little bit history about my swiss luger 06/29.

A picture of a P stampmark on a very unusual position. I know P means private. No worries the white dots are from a white papertissue.
http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0132.jpg

If you compare pictures 06/29 luger 59998 from pisto there is no P stampmark like mine at the same position-why? Need an explanation for it. I think that's strange and not standard.

And here is the orginal receipt.
http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0134.jpg
Sorry but real names are censored.

Dean762 · 01-31-2005, 12:50 AM

Thanks for the response funfree. Not sure what the exchange rate is right now but 1000 CH Francs sounds like a really good deal. The best to you and beautiful CH.

Dean

11-07-2004, 05:48 PM	#1
Dean762 User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	1929 Swiss Luger ? Hello folks. I am considering picking up a 1929 Swiss(brown grip) to go with a WW2 Ord 40 Swiss uniform that I will eventually put together. I have seen them at FGS and simpsons. The ones at FGS just look a little to good and I suspect they have been rearsenaled. The one at simpsons looks all original but a bit more expensive and I dont know if it comes with a holster as do the FGS guns. Any thoughts or recommendations? I really want one of these guns but Im not sure which way to turn at this point. Thanks for any help.

11-08-2004, 10:51 AM	#4
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Dean, Since the Swiss and Dutch both had regular refurbishment programs in place, IMHO one of their lugers that has been ARSENAL refinished, does not lessen its value as much as one refinshed here in the states. Generally an arsenal job is difficult to detect, other than the marking being a bit "soft". TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 [email protected]

11-09-2004, 10:32 AM	#6
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,154 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,306 Times in 1,097 Posts	Dean, if you are interested in Swiss Lugers and you don't own Vittorio Bobba's book on them. That should be your first purchase... I know a local place that has one for $125.00... I can pick it up for you if you want... Same price, plus what ever it costs for me to ship it... just let me know. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

11-10-2004, 09:28 AM	#11
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	For any one needing brown plastic bottomed M29 Swiss mags, I still have a few like new ones available @$75 each, also spare Brown swiss cross marked bottoms separately, exc @$25 or G @$10 and one set of unused Black M29 grips @$50. Finally, I have one unused M29 7.65x120 original M29 barrel available @$250 plus many other Swiss marked luger parts. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 [email protected]

11-12-2004, 10:22 AM	#15
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Dean, Just let me know when you are ready for a mag. I also have a good supply of Fiocchi berdan primed 30 luger ammo @$25/box of 50 or I may also have a few boxes of more easily reloadable, boxer primed Winchester or Remington @$30/bx. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 [email protected]

11-07-2004, 06:47 PM	#2
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hi Dean, As I have all three M1929 Bern lugers (red, brown, and black); I cannot discourage any luger collector from picking up a M1929. But I might be biased. If you are planning to only buy one M1929; I think the red-plastic ones are the most desirable and may yield a bit more investmemt return when you are ready to sell it in the future. If you can find out the serial number of the brown M1929 luger you are considering, let us know and we can check a couple of Swiss luger books to make sure your serial number is "correct" to have brown plastic grips and magazine bottom. The red canevasit plastic was quite fragile and brittle...and many have been replaced with the more common brown and/or black plastic parts. If your serial number places your luger in the proper range for red plastic but now has brown plastic...it might be harder to resell in the future. If your serial number places the gun you are considering squarely in the proper serial number range for brown, you will not need to explain this in the future to prospective buyers and/or other collectors. I think a nice, original finished brown M1929 Swiss luger would sell in the $ 1600-1900 USD price range...maybe a bit higher with dealers than private parties... M1929 Swiss holsters are pretty easy to find here in the USA or even in Switzerland...range is from $ 75 to $ 200 depending on condition. Buying a holster and pistol from a dealer will probably cost you more than just buying the luger and finding a holster on your own... I have worked with both the FGS folks and the Simspon folks. If you send emails letting them know you only want a factory original finished piece and not a Bern rework; they will usually give you their honest opinions in writing about a piece you might be interested. This written reply would be your documentaion trail in case, for some reason, you do not like the piece when you open the box and you return the gun...might help then with which party pays for shipping one or both ways... Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

11-07-2004, 08:50 PM	#3
Dean762 User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks for this great info Pete. It really helps. I will let you know what I come up with. Are there any telltale signs or marks of a Bern rework? I know the K31 was marked with the year on the tang that it was repaired or rebuilt. anything similar on Lugers?

11-09-2004, 05:30 AM	#5
Dean762 User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks LugerDoc. Pete, what would the correct serial # range be for brown plastic grips and mag bottoms? The best! Dean

11-09-2004, 11:31 AM	#7
Dean762 User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	You are right John. Thanks. I do need that book. I know simpsons has/had them. Havent checked the prices though.

11-09-2004, 07:44 PM	#8
Dean762 User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Would the 633xx ser range qualify for the brown grips on the 1929? I did order the Parabellum book today. Probably get it in a week or so.

11-09-2004, 09:38 PM	#9
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hi Dean, A serial # 63xxx would certainly be well into the "brown" plastic... From the info. presented in V. Bobba's book and a few other books, here is the color vs. serial number ranges (Please note the cut-over dates and/or serial numbers are not firm and some overlap occurs) : # 50001 to # 57000 - Red plastic in years 1933-39 # 57000 to # 65000 - Brown plastic in years 1939-42 # 65000 to end (~ # 77941) - Black plastic in years 1942-46 In the commercial range (i.e. P25xxx series) : # P25000 to # P25300 - Red plastic # P25301 to # P25800 - Brown plastic # P25801 to # P26600 and # P77941 to # P78258 - Black plastic Regards, Pete... <img border="0" alt="[typing]" title="" src="graemlins/yltype.gif" />

11-09-2004, 10:59 PM	#10
Dean762 User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Pete your the best. This really helps. Thanks Dean

11-11-2004, 12:23 AM	#12
Dean762 User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	LugerDoc put me down for one mag. Maybe another one later. I have a 1929 coming in next week and want to be sure I like it before buying extras. You can contact me at [email protected] if you like. Thanks Dean

11-11-2004, 02:12 AM	#13
Dean762 User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	By the way guys. Any good suggestions on where to pick up some 7.65/30 luger ammo? I know Fiocchi makes it. Anyone else?

11-12-2004, 01:36 AM	#14
Steve Richards User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Beaverton, Oregon Posts: 487 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Dean, Check the Shooting and Reloading section. There is an active thread about .30 ammo. Steve

01-04-2005, 06:50 PM	#16
StirThePot New User Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 2 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Fiocchi .30 Luger Just bought a case of Fiocchi .30 Luger from Graf & Sons, Mexico, MO.

01-30-2005, 07:06 AM	#17
funfree New User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Switzerland Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0121.jpg Yeahh i bought it yesterday for 1000 swiss francs. I'm swiss and I live in switzerland. This swiss parabellum 06/29 is in a very good condition and rarely used. The barrel is also in very good condition. The gunnummer is 59483 produced august 1940. http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0130.jpg There is no refinish or something. Well thats my first luger in my collection. As a swiss citizien swiss luger are not so expensive to buy in my country. Around 900-1300 swiss francs for Luger 06/29 depend which quality you want. This is my sechond swiss army pistol. Now in the swiss army i use the armypistol p 75 (SigP220 9mm) Well I hope you see the photos clearly. This forum is really informative. Ohh sorry i forget the holster for this parabellum here is it. http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0108.jpg The Holster is from A.TRACHSEL 40 LEISSIGEN I`m quite happy now. I saw in germany 06/29 in this condition like mine you have to pay around 1000 Euro (ca. 1500 swiss francs) or more if you want to buy one. Last edited by funfree; 01-30-2005 at 09:54 PM.

01-30-2005, 08:36 PM	#18
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hi Alex, Thanks for posting your photos of your M1929 Bern luger and holster. Congratulations on a very nice rig purchase. Prices in the USA for a brown Bern 1929 luger and holster would be closer to $ 1800-2000 USD... Regards, Pete...

01-30-2005, 09:32 PM	#19
funfree New User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Switzerland Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I didn't know that my swiss luger 06/29 would be so expensive in the USA. I was such a lucky boy. I bought it by a private person (this kind for gunsale is allowed in switzerland by law). The former possesor explained me he bought this pistol once 15 years ago from an old former swiss army officier. The former officier almost never used this swiss luger in the army. This Parabellum is in a superb condition for collecting. The man who sold me the gun told me that. This swiss luger 06/29 is really for me in a excellent orginal finish and makes me feel really happy about it. I think the price of 1000 swiss francs was a good one for this quality. This was a little bit history about my swiss luger 06/29. A picture of a P stampmark on a very unusual position. I know P means private. No worries the white dots are from a white papertissue. http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0132.jpg If you compare pictures 06/29 luger 59998 from pisto there is no P stampmark like mine at the same position-why? Need an explanation for it. I think that's strange and not standard. And here is the orginal receipt. http://photobucket.com/albums/v310/funfree/IMG_0134.jpg Sorry but real names are censored. Last edited by funfree; 01-31-2005 at 01:35 AM.

01-31-2005, 12:50 AM	#20
Dean762 User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 72 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	1929 Thanks for the response funfree. Not sure what the exchange rate is right now but 1000 CH Francs sounds like a really good deal. The best to you and beautiful CH. Dean