Help with Unit Marks

[Mike B]

Guys,
Can anyone interpret or tell me the meaning of this unit mark?

Thanks,
Mike

[abukafura]

This unit mark shows that the Luger belonged to Infantry Regiment 419, 2d company,weapon number 10

[Norme]

Those unit marks appear to be smaller than regulation size. Regards, Norm

[George Anderson]

Must be a 1915 or later pistol.

[Mike B]

OK, I will let the cat out of the bag. It is a 1914 trliple crown X. It's not mine yet, so can't say much more.

Mike

[George Anderson]

What's the serial number? You have a real prize there Mike. Good luck.

[Mike B]

George,
Thanks for the kind words. The serial number is 8447a.

[George Anderson]

Mike, thanks. It hangs out there with another unit marked slick-back 8702a.

[Mike B]

Well, we put the deal together today. In his new book, Central Powers Pistols, on page 36, Jan Still lists only 15 others like this one. I feel certain that since this book was printed, more have been accounted for, but this is one not listed. So, Mr.Still, if you happen to read this, here is one you can add for the future. Pictures will follow after it arrives.

Mike

[Ron Wood]

Congratulations Mike! Welcome to the club. Mine is one of the 15, #8310a.

[Mike B]

Ron, Et al,

Any information on how many of the 15 are unit marked? Maybe we could have a forum roll call to see how many forum members have one of these or know where one is. Possibly get a brief description.

Mike

[George Anderson]

I know of four; one is unit marked.

[Ron Wood]

Mine is not unit marked.

[Mike B]

Well, there's a start. Out of these 6, including the one a have in transit, two are unit marked. Anybody else want to chime in?

Mike

[Neil Young]

For those of us who don't know, what accounts for the rarity and desireability of these pistols. Thanks.

Neil

[Mike B]

There are very few Lugers with a crown XXX proof. In 1913 and 1914 there was a rush to get more weapons in the hands of the military due to escalating war tension. A few luger that were intended for commercial sales (5 digit serial) were diverted into military service. These Lugers did not have the normal commercial proof. Insteard they are proofed with the triple crown X. These were the 1908 and a few 1914 commercials. To add to this, a few four digit serial 1914 military Lugers were also diverted. They too were proofed with triple X proof. These 1914 military are the subject of this discussion, as only a very few have been accounted for. I feel certain that a more qualified member will add to this. Here is a picture of that proof.

[Ron Wood]

As Mike has pointed out, these Triple-X Eagle proofed guns fall into two categories...the 5-digit commercial series that lacks a chamber date and the military style marking of the 4-digit "a" suffix series that is chamber dated 1914. The unusual thing about these limited variations is the 1908 pattern of most of the the guns in 1914, well after the stock lug was introduced. The Commerical 5-digit series might be designated "08/14 Commercial/Military" while the 4-digit "a" series might be designated "08/14 Military". The Commercial guns having a stock lug might be called "1914 Commercial/Military". At least, these are my designations . All of the known 08/14 Militaries fall into the 8XXXa serial number range. It would appear that the 08/14 Commercial/Miliitaries and 1914 Commercial/Militaries were indeed diverted from Commercial stock, while the 08/14 Militaries were specifically produced for the Army using up existing 1908 frames on hand.

The very limited numbers and unusual configuration and proofs make these variations quite desirable as collector items. Unit marking is icing on the cake.

[Don M]

Then, there is this oddball: http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthread.php?t=23910.

[Mike B]

Nine months later, another 1914 triple X proof, "a" back popped up. It is on Jans' forum. Serial number is 9377a.