new byf

Steinar · 12-24-2006, 10:02 AM

This was my Christmas gift this year

A quite beaten up around the takedown lever, no idea why and how this is done.. But I think it will be a nice Luger after a complete refinish

It's marked 1939 + byf with sear safety. Any thoughts about it? It's matching.

Wish you all a Merry Christmas!

Steinar

Balder · 12-24-2006, 11:47 AM

Steinar,

I like your choice of Christmas gifts - I gave myself another byf 42 and a 6" Colt Python.

God jul!

Balder

Steinar · 12-24-2006, 12:23 PM

Balder, I'm always happy with the gifts from my wife ..as long as I can pick them out myself

There is something about the byf's I like very much.. We obviosly share more than our location!

God jul!

pipeman45 · 12-24-2006, 12:26 PM

Just a thought. Could that lever be repaired?

Lugerdoc · 12-24-2006, 12:42 PM

Balder, Based on the CCU commerical proofing on the left receiver and the E/L police acceptance on the right, I would have expected this 1939 to have a Mauser banner toggle assy. Also the E/n proof on the breech block would appear to be later than 1939 era. Your full serial number, including the suffix letter, would be helpful, to see if it fits into a group of 1939 E/L Police accepted PO8s. TD levers usually get damaged in this way from not taking the top "out of battery" before trying to release the lever. TH

Steinar · 12-24-2006, 12:52 PM

Thanks for the reply Tom, the full serial number is 20 without any suffix under.
Silly thing to crack the takedown lever this way..
I'm very curious to learn more about this one. It must be very early in production..?

JuergenG · 12-24-2006, 03:39 PM

byf and 1939, is this a parts gun ?

Steinar · 12-24-2006, 10:20 PM

yes, I expected it to be a S/42 when I got it.. looking forward to learn more about it.

With the low #, sear safety and a comercial and police markings it's all a bit strange..
It comes from an old Luger collector, now in health care. His Luger collection where sold out by his younger friend, who had no information about it..

Steinar

Lugerdoc · 12-25-2006, 11:36 AM

Steinar, Most of the 1939 E/L Police banners fall in the W suffix block, but none as low as #20w. I would carefully check the front of frame and receiver for renumbering. TH

Steinar · 12-25-2006, 12:45 PM

Not sure if it's worth the restoration if it's reblued and in other ways messed with.. I cant find any evidence for it to have had any suffix under the 20 on the frame, only that is has been reblued. Will try to take a photo of the front when I get the chance. I appreciate the inputs!

Steinar

Alx · 12-25-2006, 05:44 PM

Takedown lever area damage was probably result of someone trying to move the lever down without pushing the barrel/slide back at the same time.
Looks like maybe a screwdriver was used for the extra leverage to pry against the take-down lever, and maybe driven with a hammer for extra force, which would have damaged the metal of the frame around the lever hole and also breaking the lever knob.

Steinar · 12-26-2006, 07:35 AM

Yes, I agree.. such a prossess would require a screwdriver, hammer and quite a lot of stupidity

Perhaps this one has got a new toggle with the same #as the frame and receiver. And that the reason for the low # without suffix, is that it has been exported to the Norwegian police.. but in 1939?? strange strange.. Starting to smell a little bogus, but since it was sold without description to below average price, I'm not tearing out my hears yet.

Steinar

pisto · 12-27-2006, 12:18 PM

broken take down levers can be found at quite a few lugers - people donÃ?Â´t know how to take it apart.
Steinar, are you sure that his gun is reblued?
another theorie:
should a byf 42 not have the eagle test proof instead of the crown U and did byf not appear later?

pisto · 12-27-2006, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pisto

steinar, I have thought about the wrong toggle train also..
so sorry, broken take down levers can be found at quite a few lugers - people donÃ?Â´t know how to take it apart!
Steinar, are you sure that his gun is reblued?
another theorie:
should a byf 42 not have the eagle test proof instead of the crown U and did byf not appear later?
does this police luger still have the magazine safety

Steinar · 12-27-2006, 01:13 PM

Pisto, I'm quite sure it's reblued..
it 'feels' reblued, more in black, than if not.

-There is no colour difference on frame and the upper parts. So if it has been reblued, this would have been done to the Luger as it is now. With the byf toggle.
-There is no magazine safety
-No signs of suffix under the 20

If someone have more information about the crown U, it would be great (away from my books at the moment).

regards
Steinar

pisto · 12-27-2006, 08:36 PM

About the rebluing: my 1913 DWM Police Luger is reblued also, this is made in the 30ies as they installed the Schiwy safety (trigger bar safety) in the Police amory and this can be observed on many Police Lugers.
I have seen that quite a few times, even when I have looked at Simpson LTD web page. I donÃ?Â´t know if IÃ?Â´m right but my idea is it should be a banner 1939 Mauser?
all you need is a middle toggle with a banner and #20
http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=2241

Steinar · 12-28-2006, 07:37 AM

thanks for the link and reply

Yes, they look very much alike.. except mine has a crown U, no suffix and the byf instead of banner.

If something has been done to it, it has not been done to enhance the value, since I got it for less than 400USD

pisto · 12-28-2006, 08:11 AM

no suffix is not a problem, as far as I know first 10.000 pices produced, didnÃ?Â´t have a suffix at all. I have a 1916 Luger also without suffix!! Thea crown U is also usual for 1939 Banner Lugers.
In case you are unhappy with it send it to me!

12-24-2006, 10:02 AM	#1
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	new byf This was my Christmas gift this year A quite beaten up around the takedown lever, no idea why and how this is done.. But I think it will be a nice Luger after a complete refinish It's marked 1939 + byf with sear safety. Any thoughts about it? It's matching. Wish you all a Merry Christmas! Steinar __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

12-24-2006, 12:23 PM	#3
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	Balder, I'm always happy with the gifts from my wife ..as long as I can pick them out myself There is something about the byf's I like very much.. We obviosly share more than our location! God jul! __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

12-24-2006, 12:26 PM	#4
pipeman45 User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Kentucky Posts: 539 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Just a thought. Could that lever be repaired? __________________ Dave

12-24-2006, 12:42 PM	#5
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Balder, Based on the CCU commerical proofing on the left receiver and the E/L police acceptance on the right, I would have expected this 1939 to have a Mauser banner toggle assy. Also the E/n proof on the breech block would appear to be later than 1939 era. Your full serial number, including the suffix letter, would be helpful, to see if it fits into a group of 1939 E/L Police accepted PO8s. TD levers usually get damaged in this way from not taking the top "out of battery" before trying to release the lever. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 [email protected]

12-24-2006, 12:52 PM	#6
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	Thanks for the reply Tom, the full serial number is 20 without any suffix under. Silly thing to crack the takedown lever this way.. I'm very curious to learn more about this one. It must be very early in production..? __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

12-24-2006, 11:47 AM	#2
Balder User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Norway Posts: 288 Thanks: 20 Thanked 34 Times in 19 Posts	Steinar, I like your choice of Christmas gifts - I gave myself another byf 42 and a 6" Colt Python. God jul! Balder

12-24-2006, 03:39 PM	#7
JuergenG User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 155 Thanks: 3 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	byf and 1939, is this a parts gun ?

12-24-2006, 10:20 PM	#8
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	yes, I expected it to be a S/42 when I got it.. looking forward to learn more about it. With the low #, sear safety and a comercial and police markings it's all a bit strange.. It comes from an old Luger collector, now in health care. His Luger collection where sold out by his younger friend, who had no information about it.. Steinar __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

12-25-2006, 11:36 AM	#9
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	Steinar, Most of the 1939 E/L Police banners fall in the W suffix block, but none as low as #20w. I would carefully check the front of frame and receiver for renumbering. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 [email protected]

12-25-2006, 12:45 PM	#10
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	Not sure if it's worth the restoration if it's reblued and in other ways messed with.. I cant find any evidence for it to have had any suffix under the 20 on the frame, only that is has been reblued. Will try to take a photo of the front when I get the chance. I appreciate the inputs! Steinar __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

12-25-2006, 05:44 PM	#11
Alx User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nashville, Tennessee area Posts: 263 Thanks: 5 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Takedown lever area damage was probably result of someone trying to move the lever down without pushing the barrel/slide back at the same time. Looks like maybe a screwdriver was used for the extra leverage to pry against the take-down lever, and maybe driven with a hammer for extra force, which would have damaged the metal of the frame around the lever hole and also breaking the lever knob.

12-26-2006, 07:35 AM	#12
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	Yes, I agree.. such a prossess would require a screwdriver, hammer and quite a lot of stupidity Perhaps this one has got a new toggle with the same #as the frame and receiver. And that the reason for the low # without suffix, is that it has been exported to the Norwegian police.. but in 1939?? strange strange.. Starting to smell a little bogus, but since it was sold without description to below average price, I'm not tearing out my hears yet. Steinar __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

12-27-2006, 12:18 PM	#13
pisto User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Germany Posts: 228 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	broken take down levers can be found at quite a few lugers - people donÃ?Â´t know how to take it apart. Steinar, are you sure that his gun is reblued? another theorie: should a byf 42 not have the eagle test proof instead of the crown U and did byf not appear later?

12-27-2006, 01:13 PM	#15
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	Pisto, I'm quite sure it's reblued.. it 'feels' reblued, more in black, than if not. -There is no colour difference on frame and the upper parts. So if it has been reblued, this would have been done to the Luger as it is now. With the byf toggle. -There is no magazine safety -No signs of suffix under the 20 If someone have more information about the crown U, it would be great (away from my books at the moment). regards Steinar __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

12-27-2006, 08:36 PM	#16
pisto User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Germany Posts: 228 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	About the rebluing: my 1913 DWM Police Luger is reblued also, this is made in the 30ies as they installed the Schiwy safety (trigger bar safety) in the Police amory and this can be observed on many Police Lugers. I have seen that quite a few times, even when I have looked at Simpson LTD web page. I donÃ?Â´t know if IÃ?Â´m right but my idea is it should be a banner 1939 Mauser? all you need is a middle toggle with a banner and #20 http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=2241

12-28-2006, 07:37 AM	#17
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	thanks for the link and reply Yes, they look very much alike.. except mine has a crown U, no suffix and the byf instead of banner. If something has been done to it, it has not been done to enhance the value, since I got it for less than 400USD __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

12-28-2006, 08:11 AM	#18
pisto User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Germany Posts: 228 Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	no suffix is not a problem, as far as I know first 10.000 pices produced, didnÃ?Â´t have a suffix at all. I have a 1916 Luger also without suffix!! Thea crown U is also usual for 1939 Banner Lugers. In case you are unhappy with it send it to me!

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