artillery

I am trying to identify this piece.The top front of the receiver is not dated , the receiver in front of the trigger plate is marked " Germany",no proof mark inside trigger plate,the frame has N under the crown .The toggel is Erfurt. The

serial # 94xx b,8 inch barrel with tangent sight. The toggel

has no sight provision, the safety is marked "geschert" ,

it has the stock lug,magazine is unmarked with wood bottom.

The barrel is not numbered and the toggel #s do not match

the rest of the #s.

hi, it seems like portugal one but surely masters on this board would give more detailed info.


regards

ka

[tom]

Its a *Frankenillery*...which is a damn sight nicer than a "Slickwillieanhillary"


Seriously, its a parts gun probably assembled after W.W.I for export sale to the US market.


They are fun shooters but no real collector value.


Hope this helps..


Tom

[Kyrie]

Hi Ralph,


It sounds like a 1920 Commercial Artillery Luger. Alas, the mismatched toggle means it was replaced at some point, probably because the original toggle broke during use. The 1920 Commercial Artilleries are uncommon pistols and can bring a premium if all original. The replacement part pretty much kills the collector value of this specimen :-(


OTOH, it could also be a â??parts pistolâ?� Artillery some one has made up from a more common four inch barreled 1920 Commercial. If the last toggle link is mismatched this may well be the case.


Hope this helps some!


Best regards,


Kyrie

[lugerholsterrepair]

Ralph, The crown N proof mark is commercial. The serial number with a letter suffix is military. It was common to have the date ground off of the chamber during the Weimar period when Germany was marketing to the U.S.The Germany mark is a Mark used to indicate the weapon was exported to an English speaking country most likely the U.S.Jerry Burney

I disagree on---no collector value. At one time a few years ago I specialized in long bl. 1920s. I never found one dirt cheap and when I sold some they fetched a good price. Part of terms of WW1 treaty limited Luger production. Generally limited beyond needs of their 100,000 man force to produce no larger than cal 30 and no longer than 4" bl. complete Lugers to sell. They could of course make longer barrels in 9mm---just not attach them to Lugers. Many if not most long bl, 1920 commercials had long bl. installed after they got here or at least out of Germany. I have old catalog from 1928 that lists various Lugers for sale. Also listed is a varity of long artillery type barrels and barrels with receivers attached. Most Commercial artillery barrels that I consider original Are stamped Germany. Better yet would be to have crown N proof and germany. I have owned a couple of 2 barrel and receiver sets that had been together since the 1920s. The other possibility is one of the Mentor Arms or Sarco bls. has been installed more recently and an original Erfurt artillery toggle assembly has been installed to eliminate the fixed rear sight. Still a nice set up and collector grade or not it should be worth a few bucks. Lets see--a $400 1920---another $50 at least to trade toggle assy--$275 for the artillery bl then $175 for the sight---well let the reader add it up. A nice Luger hope you enjoy it.

Germany Stamp on Lugers. This marking was applied in accordance with US requirements. This not only applied to Lugers but other imported firearms as well. Copies of S&W,Colts,etc. were being made prior to the turn of the century and sold in the US. A law was later passed which required the country of Mfg to be marked on guns imported to US. England had similar requirement. Note Lugers with very small stamp "not English make" and a arm and hammer British proof. Interesting to note than Current import marks tend to devalue a gun--while Germany stamp on a 1920 Luger tends to inhance desirability.

[Aaron]

Both of my 1920 commercials (which are quite minty, as so many of them are) lack the "Germany" stamp. How would one guess they entered the U.S.? Is it more common to find these guns with or without the stamp?

[lugerholsterrepair]

Aaron, My Imperial Navy Luger Stock has both the military serial and Germany stamped on it. I cannot answer your question but I would guess they came in both ways as laws were not that actively enforced back in the twenties and thirties. Many people travled by ship and could simply bring a pistol bought in Germany into the country, Germany was probably used much like an import stamp through a dealer. Jerry Burney

Gentlemen...Thank you. I appreciate your knowledge and comments. I intend to list this piece for sale and did not want to misrepresent it. I am very impressed with this forum and thank those who helped with my questions.


To Art Buchanan: Thanks for an unbiased, straight-forward

fair evaluation.