Mauser Parabellum prototype number 19

mauro · 04-22-2007, 07:21 PM

Hello fellows,
After around 2 years I have finally received the Mauser Parabellum prototype number 19 in .30 Luger. This pistol is numbered 10.00.1019 therefore is the 19th Mauser Parabellum made in .30 Luger. It is, so far, the only known survived of the group of 50 pistols shipped to Interarms in the beginning of the production. This is also the lower serial number today reported. Due to the delay of Mauser in reaching the final production configuration, these pistols have unique features common with the pilot group pistols. In the following photos I have attempted of summarizing the most important differences wrt the standard production. What is important to highlight is that the differences are not only superficial but, for example, the angle of the ramp of the frame is different to the one retained for the final production; this is a really big difference.
Should be really nice to have information about the others 49 prototypes in order to figure out if the are some others differences.

The analysis to highlight the differences has been done using one of around 100 Mauser Parabellum cut away models.
Have fun,
Cheers,
Mauro

On the left the Mauser Banner of the prototype #19 on the right the standard one. Note that the Mauser Banner of the #19 is equal to the one used by Mauser in the pre-WWII commercial advertisings (1937-39). Then, for any reason, Mauser changed it with the new one used for the entire post-WWII production.

On the top the prototype #19. Note the different toggle shape and the different toggle - receiver connecting pin.

The receiver front not rounded of the #19 on the right.

Really interesting the difference of the toggle ramp of the frame. On the top the cut away, on the bottom the #19.

On the right the frame of the #19. Note that not only the ramp is different but also the shape of the ramp of the standard production is more "fat" than the one of the #19.

Note that the toggle grip of the #19 is closer to the frame than the nrmal one. Note also that the frame of the #19 doesn't have the grainy surface.

The early magazine were stamped "made in holland" and not "Mauser" because produced in Netherland.

In addition, all the proof marks, the Mauser Banner, and the other written stuff but the Interarms and the Safe word are white.

I hope you enjoy my last baby.

Cheers,
Mauro

Augsburger · 04-22-2007, 08:44 PM

Very nice Mauro....well presented and congrats!!!

Dwight Gruber · 04-23-2007, 04:04 AM

Mauro,

Congratulations on your acquisition of a very rare and desirable Luger, and thank you very much for the detailed comparisons--they are truly appreciated.

Am I correct in my observation that the thumb safety lever on the prototype has a slightly rounded profile, and the production model is machined flat?

--Dwight

Vlim · 04-23-2007, 05:35 AM

Mauro,

Nice gun! Did you get it from Holger?

The magazines were all produced in the Netherlands, later the Dutch company (MFT) only produced the magazine tubes. They tried to market the magazines themselves, first with both the Mauser banner and 'made in Holland'. When Mauser protested the Mauser banner was removed, and the 'made in holland remained'. Magazines and tubes produced for Mauser only had the Mauser banner on the spine.

The last batch of Mauser magazines were made my MecGar, if my information is correct.

DaveinTN · 04-23-2007, 08:15 AM

Just curious, but what year was this prototype (# 19) built?

Dave in TN.

mauro · 04-23-2007, 04:13 PM

Hi Dave,
According to my data base October/November 1970.
Cheers,
Mauro

Steinar · 04-23-2007, 05:22 PM

Congratulations Mauro! Thank you for sharing

mauro · 04-23-2007, 05:38 PM

Hi Gerben,
No. I do not have bought this pistol from Holger. I found this gun in USA and then I have imported it. Long history but now the pleasure is proportional to the wait.
Cheers,
mauro

mauro · 04-24-2007, 04:14 PM

Dwight,
I have verified and it seems that you are right in your assumption.
Thank you for notice this point.
Cheers,
Mauro

mauro · 04-24-2007, 04:22 PM

Hello guys,
I am far to be expert in the mechanics therefore it is really difficult to me evaluate the Ã¢??side effectÃ¢?Â of the difference frame toggle ramp and the toggle distance.

For sure I know that the Mauser engineers worked for a while before defining the final angle of the ramp.

What it for you the main reason to modify the angle of the ramp? Could be related to the difference of the ammunition used?

Any help will be appreciated.

Cheers,
mauro

unspellable · 04-25-2007, 07:51 PM

I will eliminate a bit of mystery here and say that I am the person who sold #19 to Mauro. This transaction involved a lot of legalistic rigamarole and a Loooong wait on Mauro's part. I am forced to admit he is a patient man.

bradsimpson · 06-12-2007, 07:49 PM

Mauro,
Dad just got 4 fancy Interarms Lugers with engraving, Gold inlay, ivory grips, etc. They were made for the IWA Show in 1990.

Do you know anything about these?

Pete Ebbink · 06-12-2007, 08:07 PM

Hi Brad,

Do they look anything like these ?

This pair was for sale on one of the gun auction sites about 3 years ago. IIRC...Tom Armstrong went after them...but I am not sure if the deal went through or not...

lew1 · 06-12-2007, 08:59 PM

I just noticed this post.

Interesting pistol. I have one, which is higher in the serial number range.

My number is 10.00.1053

Its receiver is not rounded either.

Aaron · 06-12-2007, 09:26 PM

Mauro, I'm surprised that you neglected to mention the difference in the way the word "Original" is inscribed on the two pistols, especially the letter "a".

Vlim · 06-13-2007, 06:20 AM

@Brad,

There is some Mauser flyer information that shows these variations. Mauser tried to do something special for the annual IWA shows, but the prices were accordingly...

A 1990s flyer mentions the IWA 90 version as article number 732116
In 1998 the factory price for that version was around 12,000 DMark.

The pistol was described as follows:
Matte grey finish with silver thistle leaves as barrel engraving, Blossom inlay in platinum, strawed small parts, Ivory grips with silver monogram plate inlay, with leather case.

A number of the pistols were never actually finished when Mauser stopped pistol production. Some unbuilt pistols in their original production boxes are still available.

@Mauro,
Mauro, it's known that the first Mauser 'prototypes' were actually just Swiss model 1929 lugers that were adapted to look like Mausers. It would be interesting to compare the early prototype Mausers to Swiss 1929's see whether they used Swiss parts or guns as a basis for the first demonstration/prototype series.

mauro · 06-13-2007, 01:56 PM

Hello guys,

-- Brad --
In addition to what Gerben says, if you look at my web site in the Mauser Parabellum area you can see some scans of the advertising made by Mauser concerning this kind of pistols.
I really appreciate if you can post to me some pics, I am interested in this guns. In addition also the serial numbers should be useful for my data base.

-- lew1 --
I am really happy because your pistol is absolutely an early production. The numbering starts from 1001 therefore your Parabellum is the 53rd made by Mauser. I have the 1019, the lower number today surviving, therefore yours is the second one. We have absolutely compare the pistol therefore please post some pics!!!

-- Aaron

Aaron, you are totally right, in the first picture I have underlined that the Mauser banner follows the "old" configuration but then I have forgotten to highlight this point with the closer picture. I am going to fix this point right now.

-- Gerben

Gerben, believe me I am working on this matter. I have some pics of the "display model" made by Mauser using Swiss 06/29 to show something to the 1969 NSGA and NRA.
I am working in a document that should cover all this point, mainly the early production. Maybe you remember that I have an original Mauser manuscript that describes the early production and mainly the problem found by the Mauser Engineers in the beginning of the production.

Thank you to all for the input you can provide on this matter.

Have fun,
Mauro

bradsimpson · 06-13-2007, 02:54 PM

Guys,
Thanks for the info. The four guns, with pics and prices, will be on our site (www.simpsonltd.com) within 48 hours.

Mauro,
Yes we have the gun you mentioned.
Brad: 309-342-5800

cirelaw · 06-13-2007, 06:51 PM

If it wasnt for you, we would never experience such a Beautiful Work of Art, CABA CAUSA!!!

Pete Ebbink · 06-13-2007, 09:56 PM

Beautiful photos of these guns on the Simpson LTD site :

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=3902

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=3901

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=3899

http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=3900

This one takes ones breath away !

04-22-2007, 08:44 PM	#2
Augsburger User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Tejas Posts: 160 Thanks: 17 Thanked 14 Times in 5 Posts	Very nice Mauro....well presented and congrats!!! __________________ Wilder Eber

04-23-2007, 04:13 PM	#6
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Hi Dave, According to my data base October/November 1970. Cheers, Mauro __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service.

04-23-2007, 05:22 PM	#7
Steinar User Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 1,538 Thanks: 18 Thanked 36 Times in 21 Posts	Congratulations Mauro! Thank you for sharing __________________ Previously known as Morgan Kane

04-23-2007, 05:38 PM	#8
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Hi Gerben, No. I do not have bought this pistol from Holger. I found this gun in USA and then I have imported it. Long history but now the pleasure is proportional to the wait. Cheers, mauro __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service.

04-24-2007, 04:14 PM	#9
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Dwight, I have verified and it seems that you are right in your assumption. Thank you for notice this point. Cheers, Mauro __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service.

04-22-2007, 07:21 PM	#1
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Mauser Parabellum prototype number 19 Hello fellows, After around 2 years I have finally received the Mauser Parabellum prototype number 19 in .30 Luger. This pistol is numbered 10.00.1019 therefore is the 19th Mauser Parabellum made in .30 Luger. It is, so far, the only known survived of the group of 50 pistols shipped to Interarms in the beginning of the production. This is also the lower serial number today reported. Due to the delay of Mauser in reaching the final production configuration, these pistols have unique features common with the pilot group pistols. In the following photos I have attempted of summarizing the most important differences wrt the standard production. What is important to highlight is that the differences are not only superficial but, for example, the angle of the ramp of the frame is different to the one retained for the final production; this is a really big difference. Should be really nice to have information about the others 49 prototypes in order to figure out if the are some others differences. The analysis to highlight the differences has been done using one of around 100 Mauser Parabellum cut away models. Have fun, Cheers, Mauro On the left the Mauser Banner of the prototype #19 on the right the standard one. Note that the Mauser Banner of the #19 is equal to the one used by Mauser in the pre-WWII commercial advertisings (1937-39). Then, for any reason, Mauser changed it with the new one used for the entire post-WWII production. On the top the prototype #19. Note the different toggle shape and the different toggle - receiver connecting pin. The receiver front not rounded of the #19 on the right. Really interesting the difference of the toggle ramp of the frame. On the top the cut away, on the bottom the #19. On the right the frame of the #19. Note that not only the ramp is different but also the shape of the ramp of the standard production is more "fat" than the one of the #19. Note that the toggle grip of the #19 is closer to the frame than the nrmal one. Note also that the frame of the #19 doesn't have the grainy surface. The early magazine were stamped "made in holland" and not "Mauser" because produced in Netherland. In addition, all the proof marks, the Mauser Banner, and the other written stuff but the Interarms and the Safe word are white. I hope you enjoy my last baby. Cheers, Mauro __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service.

04-23-2007, 04:04 AM	#3
Dwight Gruber User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 3,902 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1,318 Times in 431 Posts	Mauro, Congratulations on your acquisition of a very rare and desirable Luger, and thank you very much for the detailed comparisons--they are truly appreciated. Am I correct in my observation that the thumb safety lever on the prototype has a slightly rounded profile, and the production model is machined flat? --Dwight

04-23-2007, 05:35 AM	#4
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,989 Times in 1,205 Posts	Mauro, Nice gun! Did you get it from Holger? The magazines were all produced in the Netherlands, later the Dutch company (MFT) only produced the magazine tubes. They tried to market the magazines themselves, first with both the Mauser banner and 'made in Holland'. When Mauser protested the Mauser banner was removed, and the 'made in holland remained'. Magazines and tubes produced for Mauser only had the Mauser banner on the spine. The last batch of Mauser magazines were made my MecGar, if my information is correct.

04-23-2007, 08:15 AM	#5
DaveinTN User Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tennessee Posts: 186 Thanks: 3 Thanked 15 Times in 11 Posts	Just curious, but what year was this prototype (# 19) built? Dave in TN.

04-24-2007, 04:22 PM	#10
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Hello guys, I am far to be expert in the mechanics therefore it is really difficult to me evaluate the Ã¢??side effectÃ¢?Â of the difference frame toggle ramp and the toggle distance. For sure I know that the Mauser engineers worked for a while before defining the final angle of the ramp. What it for you the main reason to modify the angle of the ramp? Could be related to the difference of the ammunition used? Any help will be appreciated. Cheers, mauro __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service.

04-25-2007, 07:51 PM	#11
unspellable User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Iowa Posts: 768 Thanks: 0 Thanked 19 Times in 11 Posts	I will eliminate a bit of mystery here and say that I am the person who sold #19 to Mauro. This transaction involved a lot of legalistic rigamarole and a Loooong wait on Mauro's part. I am forced to admit he is a patient man.

06-12-2007, 07:49 PM	#12
bradsimpson User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Galesburg, IL Posts: 135 Thanks: 0 Thanked 17 Times in 9 Posts	Fancy IWA Interarms Lugers Mauro, Dad just got 4 fancy Interarms Lugers with engraving, Gold inlay, ivory grips, etc. They were made for the IWA Show in 1990. Do you know anything about these?

06-12-2007, 08:07 PM	#13
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Hi Brad, Do they look anything like these ? This pair was for sale on one of the gun auction sites about 3 years ago. IIRC...Tom Armstrong went after them...but I am not sure if the deal went through or not...

06-12-2007, 08:59 PM	#14
lew1 Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Kentucky Posts: 1,108 Thanks: 82 Thanked 204 Times in 112 Posts	I just noticed this post. Interesting pistol. I have one, which is higher in the serial number range. My number is 10.00.1053 Its receiver is not rounded either. __________________ charlie

06-12-2007, 09:26 PM	#15
Aaron Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vista, CA Posts: 1,008 Thanks: 0 Thanked 9 Times in 9 Posts	Mauro, I'm surprised that you neglected to mention the difference in the way the word "Original" is inscribed on the two pistols, especially the letter "a".

06-13-2007, 06:20 AM	#16
Vlim Moderator Lifetime LugerForum Patron Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Europe Posts: 5,053 Thanks: 1,036 Thanked 3,989 Times in 1,205 Posts	@Brad, There is some Mauser flyer information that shows these variations. Mauser tried to do something special for the annual IWA shows, but the prices were accordingly... A 1990s flyer mentions the IWA 90 version as article number 732116 In 1998 the factory price for that version was around 12,000 DMark. The pistol was described as follows: Matte grey finish with silver thistle leaves as barrel engraving, Blossom inlay in platinum, strawed small parts, Ivory grips with silver monogram plate inlay, with leather case. A number of the pistols were never actually finished when Mauser stopped pistol production. Some unbuilt pistols in their original production boxes are still available. @Mauro, Mauro, it's known that the first Mauser 'prototypes' were actually just Swiss model 1929 lugers that were adapted to look like Mausers. It would be interesting to compare the early prototype Mausers to Swiss 1929's see whether they used Swiss parts or guns as a basis for the first demonstration/prototype series.

06-13-2007, 01:56 PM	#17
mauro FIREARM HISTORIAN AND AUT Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,535 Thanks: 106 Thanked 349 Times in 129 Posts	Hello guys, -- Brad -- In addition to what Gerben says, if you look at my web site in the Mauser Parabellum area you can see some scans of the advertising made by Mauser concerning this kind of pistols. I really appreciate if you can post to me some pics, I am interested in this guns. In addition also the serial numbers should be useful for my data base. -- lew1 -- I am really happy because your pistol is absolutely an early production. The numbering starts from 1001 therefore your Parabellum is the 53rd made by Mauser. I have the 1019, the lower number today surviving, therefore yours is the second one. We have absolutely compare the pistol therefore please post some pics!!! -- Aaron Aaron, you are totally right, in the first picture I have underlined that the Mauser banner follows the "old" configuration but then I have forgotten to highlight this point with the closer picture. I am going to fix this point right now. -- Gerben Gerben, believe me I am working on this matter. I have some pics of the "display model" made by Mauser using Swiss 06/29 to show something to the 1969 NSGA and NRA. I am working in a document that should cover all this point, mainly the early production. Maybe you remember that I have an original Mauser manuscript that describes the early production and mainly the problem found by the Mauser Engineers in the beginning of the production. Thank you to all for the input you can provide on this matter. Have fun, Mauro __________________ Mauro Baudino - www.lugerlp08.com www.paul-mauser-archive.com Mauser Company and Firearm Historian - Mauser Parabellum Certification Service.

06-13-2007, 02:54 PM	#18
bradsimpson User Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Galesburg, IL Posts: 135 Thanks: 0 Thanked 17 Times in 9 Posts	Guys, Thanks for the info. The four guns, with pics and prices, will be on our site (www.simpsonltd.com) within 48 hours. Mauro, Yes we have the gun you mentioned. Brad: 309-342-5800

06-13-2007, 06:51 PM	#19
cirelaw Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: PORT ST LUCIE, FLORIDA Posts: 12,216 Thanks: 6,209 Thanked 4,133 Times in 2,173 Posts	If it wasnt for you, we would never experience such a Beautiful Work of Art, CABA CAUSA!!!

06-13-2007, 09:56 PM	#20
Pete Ebbink User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The USA Posts: 5,919 Thanks: 0 Thanked 6 Times in 4 Posts	Beautiful photos of these guns on the Simpson LTD site : http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=3902 http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=3901 http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=3899 http://www.simpsonltd.com/product_in...oducts_id=3900 This one takes ones breath away !