Navy?

Roadkill · 05-08-2002, 10:56 PM

Can this still be listed as a Navy model?

http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?ItemNum=2671938

Johnny Peppers · 05-09-2002, 12:16 AM

It appears to have started life as a 1917 dated Navy, and was reworked during the Weimar/early Nazi era into a 4" Navy. Maybe someone with a better knowledge of Navy Lugers can help here, but I thought the Navy property marks were etched or engraved rather than stamped into the metal. The Luger pictured shows heavy stamping of the property mark to the extent that the metal is deformed.

Ron Wood · 05-09-2002, 01:40 AM

Navy property marks were stamped, just like unit markings on other military Lugers. Come to think of it, I can't think of any marks on Lugers that were not hand stamped or roll die stamped (except for presentation pieces) until the modern Mauser production came along. And these only used etching for the commemorative markings (I think). Can anyone else think of non-stamped markings (other than the hand engraved Swiss crosses and internal parts on the 1899 prototype/pre-production pieces)?

Carl · 05-09-2002, 09:02 AM

The Navy Luger by Joachim Gortz and John Walter is a good source of information on the navy Lugers, also Tom Knox the editor of Auto Mag.

Dok · 05-09-2002, 09:40 AM

But the serial number looks like it's been tampered with, the side plate doesn't look like it matches and in the condition this pistol appears to be in, he's out of his mind with that price... or am I out of mine???

Johnny Peppers · 05-09-2002, 09:58 AM

The K Date Navys with the left side inscription was not stamped for one. After searching further, on page 14 of Jan Still's TRL, he indicates that the N or O property marks were engraved on the K and G dates. On page 107 he also indicates that the 1936 thru 1940 Kriegsmarine marked pistols were engraved with the property numbers.

The early '06 Navys with the frame markings were definitely stamped.

tom · 05-09-2002, 10:03 AM

Yeah, it is clearly a Weimar era Navy conversion; the area around the SN is probably the result of the rework effecting the "halo" of the original SN, but I would want to see up close and personal before I bought it. Assuming it is legit, $1500 is not a bad price.

Tom

Who is negotiating a U-boat marked '06 Second issue as this is being written

Ron Wood · 05-09-2002, 11:00 AM

Thanks Johnny. Wish I knew my non-Imperial era Lugers better.

05-08-2002, 10:56 PM	#1
Roadkill User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,632 Thanks: 1 Thanked 28 Times in 17 Posts	Navy? Can this still be listed as a Navy model? http://www.auctionarms.com/search/displayitem.cfm?ItemNum=2671938

05-09-2002, 12:16 AM	#2
Johnny Peppers User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Calion, Arkansas Posts: 1,042 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Navy? It appears to have started life as a 1917 dated Navy, and was reworked during the Weimar/early Nazi era into a 4" Navy. Maybe someone with a better knowledge of Navy Lugers can help here, but I thought the Navy property marks were etched or engraved rather than stamped into the metal. The Luger pictured shows heavy stamping of the property mark to the extent that the metal is deformed.

05-09-2002, 01:40 AM	#3
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,022 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,179 Times in 1,703 Posts	Re: Navy? Navy property marks were stamped, just like unit markings on other military Lugers. Come to think of it, I can't think of any marks on Lugers that were not hand stamped or roll die stamped (except for presentation pieces) until the modern Mauser production came along. And these only used etching for the commemorative markings (I think). Can anyone else think of non-stamped markings (other than the hand engraved Swiss crosses and internal parts on the 1899 prototype/pre-production pieces)?

05-09-2002, 09:02 AM	#4
Carl User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Central PA Posts: 113 Thanks: 0 Thanked 5 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Navy? The Navy Luger by Joachim Gortz and John Walter is a good source of information on the navy Lugers, also Tom Knox the editor of Auto Mag.

05-09-2002, 09:40 AM	#5
Dok RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Bermuda (Eat Your Heart Out) Posts: 1,626 Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Maybe it's just my eyes... But the serial number looks like it's been tampered with, the side plate doesn't look like it matches and in the condition this pistol appears to be in, he's out of his mind with that price... or am I out of mine???

05-09-2002, 09:58 AM	#6
Johnny Peppers User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Calion, Arkansas Posts: 1,042 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Navy? The K Date Navys with the left side inscription was not stamped for one. After searching further, on page 14 of Jan Still's TRL, he indicates that the N or O property marks were engraved on the K and G dates. On page 107 he also indicates that the 1936 thru 1940 Kriegsmarine marked pistols were engraved with the property numbers. The early '06 Navys with the frame markings were definitely stamped.

05-09-2002, 10:03 AM	#7
tom User Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 269 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Navy? Yeah, it is clearly a Weimar era Navy conversion; the area around the SN is probably the result of the rework effecting the "halo" of the original SN, but I would want to see up close and personal before I bought it. Assuming it is legit, $1500 is not a bad price. Tom Who is negotiating a U-boat marked '06 Second issue as this is being written

05-09-2002, 11:00 AM	#8
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,022 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,179 Times in 1,703 Posts	Re: Navy? Thanks Johnny. Wish I knew my non-Imperial era Lugers better.