Former artillery police rework

[PatrickB]

I have a refinished 1916 DWM shooter with no real collector value because of the refinish, but it does have some features that arouse my curiosity.

It seems to be a police rework because it has the sear safety and a matching number magazine with an aluminum rather than wood base. It has no magazine safety or police markings.

The receiver has a notch cut at the forward edge which I associate with artillery rather than regular military lugers. The barrel does not have the serial number on it, and it looks like the artillery barrel was removed and a regular barrel installed for police use. Further evidence that the Luger used to be an artillery model is that the number 14 on the part of the toggle with the rear sight is stamped with a different font than the number 14 on the rest of the components, suggesting that sightless rear toggle of the artillery was replaced with a regular piece during the rework and numbered then.

The barrel has several proof marks that may not be very visible in my photos. On the left side near the receiver is a sideways proof mark of an eagle shrugging its wings with a number 35 below. On the right side of the barrel is a proof mark of an eagle with four little lines on each side of its body to denote wings and another mark above the eagle of "FP" or "PP" with the letters close together.

I ask the police luger experts on the forum for an opinion on when and by whom would this rework have been accomplished.

[Doubs]

A notched WW1 DWM receiver, regardless of year, will have left the factory as an Artillery Luger. Erfurt, OTOH, only made Artillery Lugers in 1914. All other Erfurt notched receivers from 1916 through 1918 will have left the factory with a short barrel.

The rework into a police pistol would have been post-WW1 but exactly when and by whom is impossible to determine. The stamp on the right side of the barrel would suggest between 1928 & 1934 IF I'm reading Gortz & Sturgess on page 515 correctly.

[PatrickB]

What companies installed the sear safety? Do the barrel proof marks not identify who replaced the barrel?

[DonVoigt]

Originally Posted by PatrickB

What companies installed the sear safety? Do the barrel proof marks not identify who replaced the barrel?

The police armorers installed the sear safties.
No, the barrel proofing only indicates who "proved" the barrel.
Spare barrels were proved when made, an original barrel would show proving by the Erfurt, or the proof house that proved commercial arms for DWM or another repair facility, or the police themselves if done in house.

I can't see the proof marks on your barrel, but the description sounds like proof marks of the police or army rebuild facilities, from the '20s to the '30s.

[Doubs]

Originally Posted by DonVoigt

I can't see the proof marks on your barrel, but the description sounds like proof marks of the police or army rebuild facilities, from the '20s to the '30s.

Don, in the second picture, the barrel appears to have an Eagle/33 stamp on the left side which G&S on page 516 explain would have been applied by a military inspector at the Simpson plant. It is normally found on replacement barrels that also have the PTV/Eagle stamp. I think that the right side barrel stamp was the PTV/Eagle but poorly struck and then the refinish removed even more of it.

I had to use a magnifying glass to see those stamps well enough to determine/guess what they are.

[PatrickB]

Thanks for the explanation of how these conversions took place. I didn’t know the police themselves had the ability to do such machine work.

[DonVoigt]

Patrick,
In the 1920's and early '30s the German police force was 3 times the size of the authorized Weimar army.
They had essentially the same capabilities with respect to repair and re-building small arms as the Reichswehr, perhaps more!?

[Edward Tinker]

Usually you see eagle 6 replacement barrels, but you also see eagle 33. Either way, could have been when they received the pistol and it needed a new barrel at some point.
If new, such as a 1920's pistol, it might have arrived with a 30 luger and they were 'switched' over to 9mm.

[PatrickB]

Edward —— The Luger is a 1916 DWM, and I believe the reason it needed a new barrel for police service was that it was an artillery model. It has the notch at the receiver/ barrel interface for clearance of the artillery sights, and it looks like the toggle piece with ordinary sights was added during the rework because the “matching” number is done in a different font than the rest of the numbers.

What I first thought was an eagle 35 barrel mark is indeed an eagle 33 as you suggested. Does that mark identify the maker of the barrel and the time frame of it manufacture?

[ithacaartist]

I have a 1917 1920 property stamped DWM that also started out as an artillery. Its barrel is Nazi stamped, but it received no sear or magazine safety. We figure it to have been used by police since it came in a holster converted to police style. It escaped a terrible refinish. Nobody's in danger of cuts from the sharp edges on your Luger, I'm afraid to say.

[PatrickB]

Originally Posted by ithacaartist

I have a 1917 1920 property stamped DWM that also started out as an artillery. Its barrel is Nazi stamped, but it received no sear or magazine safety. We figure it to have been used by police since it came in a holster converted to police style. It escaped a terrible refinish. Nobody's in danger of cuts from the sharp edges on your Luger, I'm afraid to say.

I am afraid you’re right. But it looks better than it used to now that I strawed the appropriate parts using a toaster oven my wife had thrown away. It was really sad with those parts blued.

[ithacaartist]

We've seen pics of much, much worse on here. I remember that one Artillery, aside from its long bbl, would have made a perfect carry gun. There wasn't anything left on it that would catch on stuff during the draw. Smooooth...but pretty ugly.

Without even seeing it, I'd wager it looks lots better now. The softened/buffed edges won't be particularly noticeable at a glance to most, and probably won't even be noticed at all by the uninformed or non collectors.

I've also use a toaster oven to perk up the straw on some of my shooters. (thought I invented that!) Fire blue seems to be just a tad above a toaster oven's capabilities, unfortunately.

[GerColctor]

This was a military Luger that was reassigned to the Weimar police. At sometime after WW2 it was buffed and reblued, not by a government agency, but after the GI who "captured" it and took it home. At least whoever performed the "improvement", didn't damage the straw parts. You don't see Weimar police Lugers that have been polished to the point that the numbers and edges are visibly impacted.
There were thousands of good military Lugers kept in inventory in warehouses across Germany from WW1 that were available to be reissued.

[DonVoigt]

Dave wrote:
"Its barrel is Nazi stamped, but it received no sear or magazine safety. We figure it to have been used by police since it came in a holster converted to police style. "

The "barracked" Police of Weimar and nazi Germany did not add the sear or magazine safety to their luger pistols. It is not at all uncommon to find Police lugers without either.

[ithacaartist]

Don, you wrote up a very good analysis of this pistol a few years back.