A byf 41

Powdercrank · 01-24-2005, 09:20 PM

If I did this right, attached are two photos of my godfather's captured byf 41. He was a Tank Commander for General Patton in Africa and Europe. He seldom would talk about the war, I think he was still traumatized from it when he passed on a couple years ago. I only heard this story a time or two about twenty years ago, but here goes... He said he took this piece from a German officer who was surrendering his unit somewhere in Germany. He had already handed over the pistol and his men were lined up at attention. Then one of the men broke and ran for the woods. Before anyone else could react, the officer snatched back his Luger and shot his own man in the back of the head. He handed the pistol back and said, "Nobody in MY unit runs!" Rather cold was my thinking.
The pistol is all matching, down to the ventilated firing pin. The grips appear to be two different colors, but both are stamped with an 86 inside. One magazine matches the gun and has P.08, fxo and a 37 under an eagle in two places on it. The holster reads FR & K VOEGELS KOLN-DEUTZ 1936. Also WaA387 under somesort of bird. The stitching is solid and was obviously white. Other photos will follow in another post.

Powdercrank · 01-24-2005, 09:56 PM

I'll just do two at a time, this Kerosene-fired 'puter doesn't like many more...

Edward Tinker · 01-24-2005, 10:00 PM

John seems like a very nice Rig!

As you can see by my signature line, I collect stories of the war. If interested I'd like to collect it for a booklet I am making, maybe a book

If not, that is okay too.

Ed

Powdercrank · 01-24-2005, 10:02 PM

The dang thing has booted me out twice so far....

Powdercrank · 01-24-2005, 10:14 PM

ADMIN: and it's Ed, when you go to drop the picture, you click the IMG and then drop the url straight in that box, it makes the words img be on either side, actually like this img blah blah.jpg /img on each side of the img are brackets, so it looks like this [img ] but no spaces.

Ed

Powdercrank · 01-24-2005, 10:20 PM

I guess I'm getting the hang of this... The first post with no pictures was done using the browse button near the bottom of the page... the sucessful ones were done using the upload photo text thingie in the upper right of the page.

http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/lugfrt.jpg
http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/lugfrtcl.jpg

Ed, I'll tell you all I know via email, but unfortunately it isn't much.

Powdercrank · 01-24-2005, 10:34 PM

What is a rig like this worth? I have no intention of selling it, but curiosity is getting the better of me.
If anyone wants to see other photos, feel free to ask and I'll try to get them in-focus and edited down to the smallest file I can in the evenings so they upload faster.
My godfather had promised this rig to me over twenty years ago, and tossed it in my lap one of the last times I saw him before he passed away a couple years ago and said he guessed he didn't need it anymore. I was sort of surprised he had remembered after all those years his promise.
He was my dad's best friend and fishing buddy. I spent many happy hours in a boat or on the ice with him myself.

Edward Tinker · 01-24-2005, 10:39 PM

Very nice. I am traveling, you can see Simpson's LTD (see the links to the left) and check out prices, minus $200-$400 for retail prices.

Ed

John Sabato · 01-25-2005, 10:57 AM

That's a mighty fine rig John. A family heirloom treasure and a piece of history...

From your photos there appears to be some active rust on the safety bar that blocks the sear from movement. I recommend a gentle but detailed cleaning of the whole gun and intervention where that rust is concerned with some 0000 or 00000 steel wool tempered by some fine gun oil like breakfree... Then wipe everything down with it (except the grips and the leather)...

Don't store the pistol in the holster..., heep the holster cool and dry and stuffed with bubble wrap to hold its shape. Place some folded bubble wrap inside the belt loops to keep them from going flat. ANYTHING you put on the leather will speed up its age and deteroriation. Just keep it cool and dry...

The best of luck to you with this treasure... do your best to preserve it for your heirs...

Welcome to the Lugerforum.

the gunman · 01-25-2005, 02:40 PM

VERY VERY NICE BYF RIG

Powdercrank · 01-25-2005, 03:48 PM

Hi John,
The safety bar is simply hazy or frosty for some reason, there is no rust color at all on it.
As for Break Free, I learned with this very Luger that it can cause problems.
Sid had given it to me twenty years or so ago to check out to be sure it worked, as it was the only handgun at his home. Of course me being me, I had to shoot it, then cleaned it inside and out and lubed it up good all over with Break Free, which was the "Lube of the Month" as it were, at my local range. I then gave it back to him. Now fast forward to two years ago when he gave me the gun... He said he'd done nothing with it in the mean time. It sat on a shelf in a closet in it's holster all those years. It was gunked up very solidly. The L-bar in the sideplate was stuck, the firing pin was almost stuck, the toggle was very hard to operate. It's like the Break-Free turned to heavy brown grease. I had to use Q-Tips and sharpened popsicle sticks and toothpicks with kerosene to remove the residue. While I agree the stuff worked great as a preservative, and as a wonderful lubricant on ACTIVE guns, it can and will solidify over time. I kinda prefer Rem-Oil now, as I haven't observed this phenomenon with that material.

John Sabato · 01-25-2005, 04:11 PM

I hadn't really thought about long term storage... I imagine that you are correct. The military doesn't use breakfree for that purpose. Only on functioning guns.

01-24-2005, 09:20 PM	#1
Powdercrank User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North Central Indiana Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	A byf 41 If I did this right, attached are two photos of my godfather's captured byf 41. He was a Tank Commander for General Patton in Africa and Europe. He seldom would talk about the war, I think he was still traumatized from it when he passed on a couple years ago. I only heard this story a time or two about twenty years ago, but here goes... He said he took this piece from a German officer who was surrendering his unit somewhere in Germany. He had already handed over the pistol and his men were lined up at attention. Then one of the men broke and ran for the woods. Before anyone else could react, the officer snatched back his Luger and shot his own man in the back of the head. He handed the pistol back and said, "Nobody in MY unit runs!" Rather cold was my thinking. The pistol is all matching, down to the ventilated firing pin. The grips appear to be two different colors, but both are stamped with an 86 inside. One magazine matches the gun and has P.08, fxo and a 37 under an eagle in two places on it. The holster reads FR & K VOEGELS KOLN-DEUTZ 1936. Also WaA387 under somesort of bird. The stitching is solid and was obviously white. Other photos will follow in another post.

01-24-2005, 10:00 PM	#3
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,935 Thanks: 2,033 Thanked 4,533 Times in 2,093 Posts	John seems like a very nice Rig! As you can see by my signature line, I collect stories of the war. If interested I'd like to collect it for a booklet I am making, maybe a book If not, that is okay too. Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

01-24-2005, 10:02 PM	#4
Powdercrank User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North Central Indiana Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	more byf 41... The dang thing has booted me out twice so far....

01-24-2005, 10:14 PM	#5
Powdercrank User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North Central Indiana Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Maybe more byf41... ADMIN: and it's Ed, when you go to drop the picture, you click the IMG and then drop the url straight in that box, it makes the words img be on either side, actually like this img blah blah.jpg /img on each side of the img are brackets, so it looks like this [img ] but no spaces. Ed

01-24-2005, 10:20 PM	#6
Powdercrank User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North Central Indiana Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	still more byf 41 I guess I'm getting the hang of this... The first post with no pictures was done using the browse button near the bottom of the page... the sucessful ones were done using the upload photo text thingie in the upper right of the page. http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/lugfrt.jpg http://forums.lugerforum.com/lfupload/lugfrtcl.jpg Ed, I'll tell you all I know via email, but unfortunately it isn't much.

01-24-2005, 09:56 PM	#2
Powdercrank User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North Central Indiana Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I'll just do two at a time, this Kerosene-fired 'puter doesn't like many more...

01-24-2005, 10:34 PM	#7
Powdercrank User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North Central Indiana Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	What is a rig like this worth? I have no intention of selling it, but curiosity is getting the better of me. If anyone wants to see other photos, feel free to ask and I'll try to get them in-focus and edited down to the smallest file I can in the evenings so they upload faster. My godfather had promised this rig to me over twenty years ago, and tossed it in my lap one of the last times I saw him before he passed away a couple years ago and said he guessed he didn't need it anymore. I was sort of surprised he had remembered after all those years his promise. He was my dad's best friend and fishing buddy. I spent many happy hours in a boat or on the ice with him myself.

01-24-2005, 10:39 PM	#8
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,935 Thanks: 2,033 Thanked 4,533 Times in 2,093 Posts	Very nice. I am traveling, you can see Simpson's LTD (see the links to the left) and check out prices, minus $200-$400 for retail prices. Ed

01-25-2005, 10:57 AM	#9
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,154 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,306 Times in 1,097 Posts	That's a mighty fine rig John. A family heirloom treasure and a piece of history... From your photos there appears to be some active rust on the safety bar that blocks the sear from movement. I recommend a gentle but detailed cleaning of the whole gun and intervention where that rust is concerned with some 0000 or 00000 steel wool tempered by some fine gun oil like breakfree... Then wipe everything down with it (except the grips and the leather)... Don't store the pistol in the holster..., heep the holster cool and dry and stuffed with bubble wrap to hold its shape. Place some folded bubble wrap inside the belt loops to keep them from going flat. ANYTHING you put on the leather will speed up its age and deteroriation. Just keep it cool and dry... The best of luck to you with this treasure... do your best to preserve it for your heirs... Welcome to the Lugerforum. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*

01-25-2005, 02:40 PM	#10
the gunman User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Leland NC 28451 Posts: 1,017 Thanks: 1 Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts	VERY VERY NICE BYF RIG

01-25-2005, 03:48 PM	#11
Powdercrank User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: North Central Indiana Posts: 13 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi John, The safety bar is simply hazy or frosty for some reason, there is no rust color at all on it. As for Break Free, I learned with this very Luger that it can cause problems. Sid had given it to me twenty years or so ago to check out to be sure it worked, as it was the only handgun at his home. Of course me being me, I had to shoot it, then cleaned it inside and out and lubed it up good all over with Break Free, which was the "Lube of the Month" as it were, at my local range. I then gave it back to him. Now fast forward to two years ago when he gave me the gun... He said he'd done nothing with it in the mean time. It sat on a shelf in a closet in it's holster all those years. It was gunked up very solidly. The L-bar in the sideplate was stuck, the firing pin was almost stuck, the toggle was very hard to operate. It's like the Break-Free turned to heavy brown grease. I had to use Q-Tips and sharpened popsicle sticks and toothpicks with kerosene to remove the residue. While I agree the stuff worked great as a preservative, and as a wonderful lubricant on ACTIVE guns, it can and will solidify over time. I kinda prefer Rem-Oil now, as I haven't observed this phenomenon with that material.

01-25-2005, 04:11 PM	#12
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,154 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,306 Times in 1,097 Posts	I hadn't really thought about long term storage... I imagine that you are correct. The military doesn't use breakfree for that purpose. Only on functioning guns. __________________ regards, -John S "...We hold these truths to be self-evident that ALL men are created EQUAL *and are endowed by their Creator* with certain UNALIENABLE* rights, and among these are life, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of happiness..."*