comparing two Police Lugers !!

[Edward Tinker]

This is very interesting, when I was in Reno, I bought a nice police luger from Pete. Policeluger (Howard) just happened to bring one to show me, and lo and behold, it was within around 200 numbers apart! Plus, both are police unit marked.





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first mine:

[Edward Tinker]

Now PL's:

[Edward Tinker]

You may notice that PL's luger has a crossed out 7.65 on the receiver! This is very rare, and of course uncommon. Although you can't tell, the blueing of the barrel and receiver is a slightly different color.

Both are commerically proofed, then were taken into the police useage.

Both have sear safety's, mine also had a magazine safety.

Ed

[Paul L]

Ed,

Glad to hear things are getting better......sounds like y'all had a great time in Reno.............just wasn't my turn yet to join y"all................

Please expound on the meaning why the crossed out 7.65 is rare and uncommon to this newbie ?????

Were any military weapons ever taken in and reworked and accepted by police for usage ???

TIA, Regards, Paul

[Edward Tinker]

Yes and also yes.

My weimar police was thrown in my lap by my friend Pete, a nice addition to my collection.

There were both 9mm and 7.65mm used in the police, I am unsure about military, I belive the answer is no.

The 7.65 mm was put on some weapons that (from what I understand), were IN inventory and they did not want them to confuse any of the folks using them, as 9mm was much more common on larger weapons. There were also 32 ACP used, but those guns were much smaller, so less likely to confuse personnel.
Then, at some point the police decided to change it over to 9mm, but since it had been marked 7.65, then it had to be x'd out.

Reno was great, I hear there is a good show in Chattanooga, how far is that for you? My work has an office in Chattanooga and who knows?

Ed

[Paul L]

Ed,

glad to hear things are getting better..............

Downtown Chattanooga is roughly 100 miles from the house..........let me know a date and we'll see if dooable....will bring an advanced collector friend with me if possible...................

Regards, Paul

[policeluger]

What is real interesting, is that Ed caused me to look farther into my collection and unknown/forgotten to me, was an additional 1920 property dated Luger just 67 numbers away from the 7.65 crossout, grip marked L.P.Th.616., and both guns are 100% matching and matched mags.

[saxman]

Ed; You showed everything but the right-side proofs. Could you show them?

[Don M]

Howard,

I recently spotted on Ralph Shattuck's site two Lugers with x'd out 7,65 and with reported grip strap marks with S.P.B.N. and SPBN, respectively. I'm not sure how much care was taken in transcribing the periods in these marks.

I can't quite read the grip strap mark on s/n 6107. By squinting, it seems to be SP.BN.???.1494. Could you tell me what it is, including the x'd out portion?

[policeluger]

Don, it reads "S.P.Bn.609. (609 is x'ed out) 1494. Hope this helps

[Pete Ebbink]

I think the "show" Ed mentioned is the SE NAPCA event in Chattanooga on August 19, 20, and 21, 2005.

One needs to be a NAPCA member or have one "sponsor" your attendance if one is not a member. Entry fee, which includes a dinner event is $ 40 this year.

In any LF member is not a NAPCA member but would like to attend the event in TN, I would be happy to 'sponsor' your attendance at this show. You will just need to send me your name and $ 40 check and I will forward to NAPCA and you will receive a confirmation note in the mail from NAPCA.

Email : [email protected]

[ken d]

All:
I have a DWM 765 xxx out police with sear safety only, vertical C/N on cannon, horizontal C/N on frame, both on left side. Barrel numbered to frame 8419 O. Front grip marked SP.Bn.(611xxxd). 1868.

Regaards Ken D

[Edward Tinker]

Originally posted by saxman
Ed; You showed everything but the right-side proofs. Could you show them?

I'll try after I get back (in WA today, then Idaho, Nampa (Ida-Al are you around the next day or so)??

Problem I have is that I have to hold by hand, and it takes lousy pictures most of the time...

Ed

[Don M]

Howard and Ken,

Thanks very much for the info. These will be nice adds to my database. I am looking forward to researching these marks in the near future. For what it's worth, I believe Klaus Schad has identified these as being Schutzpolizei Bautzen marks from the state (not Prussian Province) of Sachsen. I agree with the Bautzen interpretation but wonder if the S might stand for S�¤chsische- instead of Schutz-. This is just a curiosity at this point and I would recommend going by Klaus' interpretation unless/until different evidence is presented.

At any rate, the Bautzen governmental district (Kreishauptmannschaft) was merged into the Dresden district in 1932 and I suspect that was when these pistols were renumbered.

I am curious whether there is any evidence on your grip straps of an earlier mark being ground off.

[Ida-Alp]

Ed--Check your PMs--Al

[ken d]

Don:

Looking at the inside of the punched area, there is a lot of distortion which has been sanded/ground off. and left in the white. Letters on stamped area are too smudged to tell if they were multiple hits. Grips straps have been "reblued " after latest police markings were applied .

Regards Ken D

[Don M]

Ken D,

Thanks for the feedback on the grip strap. I'm beginning to feel that many more of these guns had earlier marks ground off and they're just not reported -- even if some remnants of the early mark remain. It's too bad. There's a lot of history in these multiply-marked guns and it's fun to try to figure it out.