Sight alignment

Chuck Shoun · 10-30-2001, 03:01 PM

Yesterday I went shooting with my Luger. I used a B-29 silhouette target at 25 feet. The B-29 target is the 50 yard silhouette target scaled down to 50 feet. It's a great body target for refining defense shooting. Anyway, the sun was behind me in such a way that I could not see the front sight, nor align the sights -- the rear sight, front sight and target were all the same shade of black. As a "point shooter" I'm not the best on the world. I had a set of Novak sights installed on my Browning High Power -- they have a white dot each side of the rear notch and one just below the top of the front sight -- align the dots, hold center of mass, fire! That gave me the following idea.

After cleaning the Luger, I cleaned the rear surfaces of the rear sight and the front sight with alcohol to remove all grease and oil. I made a dot on each side of the "V" notch on the rear sight on the back side of the sight and painted the top 1/16 inch on the back side of the front sight. I used a Pilot GOLD MARKER. It is a small felt tip type marker but uses paint instead of ink. These are available at K-Mart and maybe many other stores. So far it seems to enable me to align the sights much quicker. Especially when holding a center of mass hold on the silhouette target. Thought it might be handy to other shooters, too.

John Sabato · 10-30-2001, 03:26 PM

Years ago, I would use international orange model paint for such sight picture "improvements"

It definitely catches any available light, and comes off with a toothbrush and solvent when you don't want it there anymore. I would use a toothpick to put a small drop on the top eighth inch of the front sight blade, and then wipe it off with my finger leaving only the serrations on the back of the blade filled with the bright paint. This works well on any pistol (or iron-sighted rifle for that matter) that uses a front sight blade that is serrated on the rear surface.

-regards,

John Sabato

HÃ?Â¥kan Spuhr · 10-30-2001, 05:02 PM

All target guns that i am avere of have sights that are black on black.

I know that numerous companys and individuals have experimented with differnet colours and peepsights etc.

But still are almost all good targetshooters using black on black.

I can though understand the need for tritium inserts in a gun that should be used in bad light.

Regards HÃ?Â¥kan

http://www.vapensmedjan.com

Thor · 10-30-2001, 06:05 PM

I got some progress bifocals and now I can actually see the front sight! Made a WORLD of difference in my shooting. When I was shooting competition bowling pins, the guy running the match would turn all the lights off, then turn on just the red and blue flashing police car type lights, MAN, it is hard to see the sights, but I guess it was to show us just how hard it was to shoot at night! Night sights made a hell of a difference, but I dont like them during the brighter lights, I like the black sights the best! I think the BIGGEST improvement on Luger Sights is to have a proper rectagular blade (partridge type) front blad instead of the triangular shaped one and have the notch widened to a straight slot the same depth as the original, it makes the sight alignment MUCH easier to see. ~Thor~

John Sabato · 10-30-2001, 06:10 PM

and I even agree with you when it comes to punching holes in paper targets that are to be scored...

I am not talking about bullseye shooters on a range with optimum lighting conditions here, but rather defensive shooting in low light conditions... Black sights on a black target in minimal light conditions require either excellent instinctive aiming or an applicance to improve your chances of a hit in a vital zone... this is the basis for the red-dot type sights used in serious combat applications. Highlighting of iron sights is method to improve "scoring" in this real-world shooting application.

Having spent 20 years of my life carrying loaded weapons in the US Army, sights modified for low-light conditions have their time and place in shooting situations where everybody doesn't get to go home when the shooting is over.

kind regards,

John Sabato

G.T. · 10-30-2001, 06:18 PM

This argument is almost as old as firearms!! Payne or Paine (spelling?) sights, a bead front with a small u rear, have been very popular with sport shooters and hunters for decades. The Patridge sight(again spelling?)consisting of a square notch with a square front was specifically designed for target shooting, but has become widely accepted as all purpose, and it is hard to argue with it's success. I have found, that an excellent shot, (not me!) can shoot either sight, with excellent results. If it helps, put on some paint! till...later...G.T.

Big Norm · 10-30-2001, 10:33 PM

I agree with John for hunting with a rifle. My hunting rifle had the black worn off of front sight and the brass was yellow. Last year we had a lot of snow in Northern Michigan and I just could not see the front sight. I ended up shooting a deer at 25 feet with my scope because I could not see the front sight in the bright snow conditions. This year I am going to use some bright red fingernail polish on that front sight. Not that I am arguing with John with the color, it was just something that I had laying around. And 'NO!' I don't personally use fingernail polish. But I sure do hesitate using good alcohol on a gun instead of in a glass.

Big Norm

HÃ?Â¥kan Spuhr · 10-31-2001, 05:31 PM

I agree with you too, but the discussion was actually about punshing hole in a b29 target at 25 yards.

I can only totally agree with Ted Green that good square sights is the bigest improvement that can be made for that purpose.

Selfdefence is another thing, but for self defence i would never keep the original almost unvisiable sights that are original on a Luger.

Regards HÃ?Â¥kan

Chuck Shoun · 10-31-2001, 06:21 PM

I might add a little information. The B29 target is a body silhouette target, much like those used at police ranges for training. One takes a "Center of Mass" sight and target alignment,rather than a "6:00 O'clock" sight and target alignment, as one would with the bulls-eye target. The paint comes off of the pistol very easisly, so we are not talking about any pemanent changes, just assisting sight alignment in certain light conditions. I shoot high power rifle competition, and am very familiar with peep/post sights and the need to "smoke" them before the match. (Make those suckers as black as possible!) I have never fired a rifle with a scope or a pistol with any optical sights, so I'm sharing a system that works for me. Again the difficulty only arises when there's a need for a "Center of Mass" hold on the target.

10-30-2001, 03:01 PM	#1
Chuck Shoun User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Brigham City, UT Posts: 30 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Sight alignment Yesterday I went shooting with my Luger. I used a B-29 silhouette target at 25 feet. The B-29 target is the 50 yard silhouette target scaled down to 50 feet. It's a great body target for refining defense shooting. Anyway, the sun was behind me in such a way that I could not see the front sight, nor align the sights -- the rear sight, front sight and target were all the same shade of black. As a "point shooter" I'm not the best on the world. I had a set of Novak sights installed on my Browning High Power -- they have a white dot each side of the rear notch and one just below the top of the front sight -- align the dots, hold center of mass, fire! That gave me the following idea. After cleaning the Luger, I cleaned the rear surfaces of the rear sight and the front sight with alcohol to remove all grease and oil. I made a dot on each side of the "V" notch on the rear sight on the back side of the sight and painted the top 1/16 inch on the back side of the front sight. I used a Pilot GOLD MARKER. It is a small felt tip type marker but uses paint instead of ink. These are available at K-Mart and maybe many other stores. So far it seems to enable me to align the sights much quicker. Especially when holding a center of mass hold on the silhouette target. Thought it might be handy to other shooters, too.

10-30-2001, 03:26 PM	#2
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,154 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,306 Times in 1,097 Posts	An excellent suggestion for Luger shooters Chuck... Years ago, I would use international orange model paint for such sight picture "improvements" It definitely catches any available light, and comes off with a toothbrush and solvent when you don't want it there anymore. I would use a toothpick to put a small drop on the top eighth inch of the front sight blade, and then wipe it off with my finger leaving only the serrations on the back of the blade filled with the bright paint. This works well on any pistol (or iron-sighted rifle for that matter) that uses a front sight blade that is serrated on the rear surface. -regards, John Sabato

10-30-2001, 05:02 PM	#3
HÃ?Â¥kan Spuhr User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Sweden Posts: 282 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	worthless idea in my opinion All target guns that i am avere of have sights that are black on black. I know that numerous companys and individuals have experimented with differnet colours and peepsights etc. But still are almost all good targetshooters using black on black. I can though understand the need for tritium inserts in a gun that should be used in bad light. Regards HÃ?Â¥kan http://www.vapensmedjan.com

10-30-2001, 06:05 PM	#4
Thor User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Rio Rancho, New Mexico Posts: 4,583 Thanks: 958 Thanked 970 Times in 276 Posts	Re: Eyesight focusing is important I got some progress bifocals and now I can actually see the front sight! Made a WORLD of difference in my shooting. When I was shooting competition bowling pins, the guy running the match would turn all the lights off, then turn on just the red and blue flashing police car type lights, MAN, it is hard to see the sights, but I guess it was to show us just how hard it was to shoot at night! Night sights made a hell of a difference, but I dont like them during the brighter lights, I like the black sights the best! I think the BIGGEST improvement on Luger Sights is to have a proper rectagular blade (partridge type) front blad instead of the triangular shaped one and have the notch widened to a straight slot the same depth as the original, it makes the sight alignment MUCH easier to see. ~Thor~

10-30-2001, 06:10 PM	#5
John Sabato Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: The Capital of the Free World Posts: 10,154 Thanks: 3,003 Thanked 2,306 Times in 1,097 Posts	Of course you are entitled to your opinion HÃ?Â¥kan... and I even agree with you when it comes to punching holes in paper targets that are to be scored... I am not talking about bullseye shooters on a range with optimum lighting conditions here, but rather defensive shooting in low light conditions... Black sights on a black target in minimal light conditions require either excellent instinctive aiming or an applicance to improve your chances of a hit in a vital zone... this is the basis for the red-dot type sights used in serious combat applications. Highlighting of iron sights is method to improve "scoring" in this real-world shooting application. Having spent 20 years of my life carrying loaded weapons in the US Army, sights modified for low-light conditions have their time and place in shooting situations where everybody doesn't get to go home when the shooting is over. kind regards, John Sabato

10-30-2001, 06:18 PM	#6
G.T. Lifer Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Chandler Arizona Posts: 3,507 Thanks: 1,318 Thanked 3,653 Times in 1,004 Posts	Sport vs.Target sights.... This argument is almost as old as firearms!! Payne or Paine (spelling?) sights, a bead front with a small u rear, have been very popular with sport shooters and hunters for decades. The Patridge sight(again spelling?)consisting of a square notch with a square front was specifically designed for target shooting, but has become widely accepted as all purpose, and it is hard to argue with it's success. I have found, that an excellent shot, (not me!) can shoot either sight, with excellent results. If it helps, put on some paint! till...later...G.T.

10-30-2001, 10:33 PM	#7
Big Norm RIP Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: SE Michigan Posts: 1,864 Thanks: 1 Thanked 6 Times in 5 Posts	HUNTING SIGHTS I agree with John for hunting with a rifle. My hunting rifle had the black worn off of front sight and the brass was yellow. Last year we had a lot of snow in Northern Michigan and I just could not see the front sight. I ended up shooting a deer at 25 feet with my scope because I could not see the front sight in the bright snow conditions. This year I am going to use some bright red fingernail polish on that front sight. Not that I am arguing with John with the color, it was just something that I had laying around. And 'NO!' I don't personally use fingernail polish. But I sure do hesitate using good alcohol on a gun instead of in a glass. Big Norm

10-31-2001, 05:31 PM	#8
HÃ?Â¥kan Spuhr User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Sweden Posts: 282 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Of course you are entitled to your opinion HÃ?Â¥kan... I agree with you too, but the discussion was actually about punshing hole in a b29 target at 25 yards. I can only totally agree with Ted Green that good square sights is the bigest improvement that can be made for that purpose. Selfdefence is another thing, but for self defence i would never keep the original almost unvisiable sights that are original on a Luger. Regards HÃ?Â¥kan

10-31-2001, 06:21 PM	#9
Chuck Shoun User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Brigham City, UT Posts: 30 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Sight alignment I might add a little information. The B29 target is a body silhouette target, much like those used at police ranges for training. One takes a "Center of Mass" sight and target alignment,rather than a "6:00 O'clock" sight and target alignment, as one would with the bulls-eye target. The paint comes off of the pistol very easisly, so we are not talking about any pemanent changes, just assisting sight alignment in certain light conditions. I shoot high power rifle competition, and am very familiar with peep/post sights and the need to "smoke" them before the match. (Make those suckers as black as possible!) I have never fired a rifle with a scope or a pistol with any optical sights, so I'm sharing a system that works for me. Again the difficulty only arises when there's a need for a "Center of Mass" hold on the target.