Just Inherited

Bill Russell · 06-01-2009, 01:49 PM

Hello Everyone.

I just inherited my Dad's 1913 Erfurt Luger, serial number 4281 all numbers matching. It is in great shape and I don't know if I will keep it or sell it.
When I reassemble the gun, the barrel seems to slide back and forth too easily. Am I doing something, or everything wrong?

Try inverting the frame when you slide the barrel & receiver on. You'll see a small hook that needs to be engaged. See if this helps.
Brendan

Bill, Yes..not everything but the hook on the bottom of the toggle is not hooked to the mainspring.
When sliding the toggle onto the receiver the hook will slide over all untill it gets to the back and then it will fall into the well where it is supposed to hook onto the mainspring. This is a little tricky but easily accomplished. Like Brendan says..you may have to tilt the pistol onto it's back for the hook to fall into place.
When the toggle hook is in place you can see that it is positioned to hook but the toggle must be slid back and firmly establish the hook. This can be done one handed with your thumb in the web of the pistol handle and your fingers wrapped around and over the toggle.

When this is hooked in place you will be able to feel the resistance. Holding the toggle and the handle of the pistol in place, push the muzzle onto a hard surface, not a slippery one though and push down on the muzzle, This action will push the toggle out of battery and enable you to place the sideplate on with your left hand and lock it with the locking lever.

Once you realize how it works and get the hang of it there will be no problems. The barrel & toggle will be held firmly in place by the mainspring.

Jerry Burney

Just inherited complete Erfurt 1913 Luger serial number 4281, all numbers matching, in great shape. The barrel seems to slide rather too easily when I reassemble the gun. Am I doing something or everything wrong? I followed the video on the internet to the T!

Bill Russell, Welcome to the Lugerforum!

You apparently didn't assemble the upper to the frame correctly.
There is a hook which hangs down from the assembled upper and it is supposed to be under the lever that is tensioned by the mainspring on assembly. I think you missed hooking the lever... take it back apart and try again...

There should be spring tension on the last half inch or so of movement prior to completing assembly with the sideplate and takedown lever.

Next time you wish to ask a question that is not related to the thread you are viewing, please start your own message thread instead of tacking your question into an existing thread. That way any answers you get to YOUR question, are separate from the answers to the thread you were reading.

Bill, welcome to the forum.

Would love to see your 1913, I like the earlier ones!

Ed

Edward Tinker · 06-01-2009, 05:22 PM

Well hell..... I tried to put all the threads into a new thread and instead merged them into one posting Bill.

Sorry about that.

ed

Ron Smith · 06-01-2009, 06:50 PM

There ya go... Can't get good help now days.

lugerholsterrepair · 06-01-2009, 07:07 PM

Ron, Maybe if we double Ed's salary?

Jerry Burney

Bill Russell · 06-01-2009, 09:01 PM

Thanks to everyone for their advice. When I reassemble the pistol, I do invert it so that the barrel section just slides on, then I turn the gun over and make sure that little curved T shaped spring falls into the well.
This is the point where I get confused. Should I pull the toggle to the open position, then add the magazine, then put on the side plate?
When I do this, the side plate goes on very easily, but, the barrel slides back and forth when the safety is off.
IF I engage the side plate after pushing back on the barrel (it takes a little force) the barrel stays put, with just a little give when you push on it.
I was worried that the little catches on the side plate would be damaged under what I thought was too much pressure.
Also when I do this, the toggles take some force to pull back, which I guess could be because they are pulling on a big spring?
Anyhow, thanks to everyone for their kindness dealing with a Newbie. I truly appreciate it.

Bill

lugerholsterrepair · 06-01-2009, 09:11 PM

Bill, Should I pull the toggle to the open position, then add the magazine, then put on the side plate?
You MUST not pull the toggle to the open position! The pistol is put together with the toggle & bolt CLOSED!
Nor should you insert the magazine. Put the magazine in the sock drawer. It has NOTHING to do with re assembling the pistol properly. Did you see it mentioned in my previous post?
.......the barrel slides back and forth when the safety is off. This is because you DO NOT have the toggle hooked to the mainspring!!!!

RE READ what I wrote.... What hooks the toggle T to the hook on the mainspring is it dropping into the well properly and then you HAVE TO PULL THE TOP BARREL & SLIDE WITH THE BOLT FLAT & CLOSED BACK & OUT OF BATTERY! This is only 3/8ths of an inch or so. This will hook the T into the mainspring hook and put the pistol into position to accept the sideplate. Once you have pulled the top cannon back, hooked the T, this will KEEP the T hooked & in place so it cannot fall forward and out. Put the muzzle on a flat surface to hold the tension, easily slip in the sideplate close the locking bolt. Snap back the toggle to cycle your Luger! WALLAH! DONE.

Jerry Burney

Jerry Burney

Bill Russell · 06-02-2009, 03:08 AM

Now, I got it. Everything is in place. No more sliding around. Just a slight "give" to the barrel when you put pressure on it. The same, I would imagine as when it fires,
Sorry for being such a slow study, but everything works now.
I broke so many things as a kid by putting too much pressure on it, I was reluctant to push the barrel back. Thought I was damaging it.
Thanks again.

lugerholsterrepair · 06-02-2009, 02:41 PM

What does the little lever on the back of the side plate do? The parts seem very small and look somewhat fragile.
Thanks,

Bill

Bill..This is the trigger transfer lever. It is held in by a dogleg pin and the lever rotates on it. The trigger has a slot in the top of it that the bottom of the lever fits into when the sideplate is installed. When the trigger is pulled down... the L shape angle of this transfer bar pushes in on the fireing pin sear found along the left side rail of the barrel & top cannon. When this sear is pushed inward.. it pivots on it's own pin and moves out of the way of the cocked flange on the fireing pin..releasing it so the compressed fireing pin spring will drive it forward to strike the primer of the cartridge found in the barrel chamber. You might notice that when the safety is activated.. it simply moves up from it's recess in the receiver and blocks the sear from pivoting out and releasing the flange on the fireing pin.
One thing to note..If there is a cartridge in the chamber and the top cannon assembly is completely off of the bottom handle of the pistol, the top cannon can be fired by simply pushing in on the front of the exposed sear bar.

Jerry Burney

lugerholsterrepair · 06-02-2009, 04:29 PM

Your mail to the following recipients could not be delivered because they are not accepting mail from [email protected]:
arribur

Thank you. The lever that releases the side plate, the same lever that raises a stop that fits into the bottom of the barrel limits the barrel's travel on recoil against the spring?
This is theside plate locking lever. This lever does not limit the barrel's travel on recoil..there is a lug on the underside of the top cannon that performs this function.

How far should you be able to pull up the toggles? The spring is rather strong, as you know. Should the toggles stay in place upright if you pull back far enough?
The toggle will only stay upright if the holdopen spring is present. This spring will ONLY activate if the magazine is in the weapon and the weapon is empty. Insert an empty magazine in the pistol and pull back on the toggle forcefully. It should stay open. To release the toggle, drop the magazine a couple of inches and this will release the upward pressure on the holdopen spring, letting it drop out of the way of the notch in the bolt allowing the toggle to release when pulled slightly rearward, once it releases you can let go and the bolt will slam into battery.

Mr. Burney, you can tell I am a gun novice. My Dad passed away last year and I am just trying to preserve his stuff and memory best I can.
Sorry to hear about your Father..Your doing the right thing. Keep learning, that's what the Forums are for. There are many manuals for the Luger pistol.
Go to Ebay, look for luger and you will likely see a manual or two. Below a link to a cheap user manual

http://cgi.ebay.com/LUGER-9mm-DISASS...2em118Q2el1247

Jerry

06-01-2009, 06:50 PM	#3
Ron Smith User Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Orygun Posts: 4,243 Thanks: 118 Thanked 245 Times in 150 Posts	There ya go... Can't get good help now days. __________________ I Still Need DWM side plate #49... if anyone runs across a nice one. What ~Rudyard Kipling~ said...

06-01-2009, 07:07 PM	#4
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,772 Thanks: 4,940 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	Ron, Maybe if we double Ed's salary? Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 l[email protected] 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

06-01-2009, 09:01 PM	#5
Bill Russell New User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: La Crescenta, California Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Inherited Luger Thanks to everyone for their advice. When I reassemble the pistol, I do invert it so that the barrel section just slides on, then I turn the gun over and make sure that little curved T shaped spring falls into the well. This is the point where I get confused. Should I pull the toggle to the open position, then add the magazine, then put on the side plate? When I do this, the side plate goes on very easily, but, the barrel slides back and forth when the safety is off. IF I engage the side plate after pushing back on the barrel (it takes a little force) the barrel stays put, with just a little give when you push on it. I was worried that the little catches on the side plate would be damaged under what I thought was too much pressure. Also when I do this, the toggles take some force to pull back, which I guess could be because they are pulling on a big spring? Anyhow, thanks to everyone for their kindness dealing with a Newbie. I truly appreciate it. Bill

06-01-2009, 09:11 PM	#6
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,772 Thanks: 4,940 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	Bill, Should I pull the toggle to the open position, then add the magazine, then put on the side plate? You MUST not pull the toggle to the open position! The pistol is put together with the toggle & bolt CLOSED! Nor should you insert the magazine. Put the magazine in the sock drawer. It has NOTHING to do with re assembling the pistol properly. Did you see it mentioned in my previous post? .......the barrel slides back and forth when the safety is off. This is because you DO NOT have the toggle hooked to the mainspring!!!! RE READ what I wrote.... What hooks the toggle T to the hook on the mainspring is it dropping into the well properly and then you HAVE TO PULL THE TOP BARREL & SLIDE WITH THE BOLT FLAT & CLOSED BACK & OUT OF BATTERY! This is only 3/8ths of an inch or so. This will hook the T into the mainspring hook and put the pistol into position to accept the sideplate. Once you have pulled the top cannon back, hooked the T, this will KEEP the T hooked & in place so it cannot fall forward and out. Put the muzzle on a flat surface to hold the tension, easily slip in the sideplate close the locking bolt. Snap back the toggle to cycle your Luger! WALLAH! DONE. Jerry Burney Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 l[email protected] 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

06-02-2009, 03:08 AM	#7
Bill Russell New User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: La Crescenta, California Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Thanks! Now, I got it. Everything is in place. No more sliding around. Just a slight "give" to the barrel when you put pressure on it. The same, I would imagine as when it fires, Sorry for being such a slow study, but everything works now. I broke so many things as a kid by putting too much pressure on it, I was reluctant to push the barrel back. Thought I was damaging it. Thanks again.

06-01-2009, 01:49 PM	#1
Bill Russell New User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: La Crescenta, California Posts: 4 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hello Everyone. I just inherited my Dad's 1913 Erfurt Luger, serial number 4281 all numbers matching. It is in great shape and I don't know if I will keep it or sell it. When I reassemble the gun, the barrel seems to slide back and forth too easily. Am I doing something, or everything wrong? Try inverting the frame when you slide the barrel & receiver on. You'll see a small hook that needs to be engaged. See if this helps. Brendan Bill, Yes..not everything but the hook on the bottom of the toggle is not hooked to the mainspring. When sliding the toggle onto the receiver the hook will slide over all untill it gets to the back and then it will fall into the well where it is supposed to hook onto the mainspring. This is a little tricky but easily accomplished. Like Brendan says..you may have to tilt the pistol onto it's back for the hook to fall into place. When the toggle hook is in place you can see that it is positioned to hook but the toggle must be slid back and firmly establish the hook. This can be done one handed with your thumb in the web of the pistol handle and your fingers wrapped around and over the toggle. When this is hooked in place you will be able to feel the resistance. Holding the toggle and the handle of the pistol in place, push the muzzle onto a hard surface, not a slippery one though and push down on the muzzle, This action will push the toggle out of battery and enable you to place the sideplate on with your left hand and lock it with the locking lever. Once you realize how it works and get the hang of it there will be no problems. The barrel & toggle will be held firmly in place by the mainspring. Jerry Burney Just inherited complete Erfurt 1913 Luger serial number 4281, all numbers matching, in great shape. The barrel seems to slide rather too easily when I reassemble the gun. Am I doing something or everything wrong? I followed the video on the internet to the T! Bill Russell, Welcome to the Lugerforum! You apparently didn't assemble the upper to the frame correctly. There is a hook which hangs down from the assembled upper and it is supposed to be under the lever that is tensioned by the mainspring on assembly. I think you missed hooking the lever... take it back apart and try again... There should be spring tension on the last half inch or so of movement prior to completing assembly with the sideplate and takedown lever. Next time you wish to ask a question that is not related to the thread you are viewing, please start your own message thread instead of tacking your question into an existing thread. That way any answers you get to YOUR question, are separate from the answers to the thread you were reading. Bill, welcome to the forum. Would love to see your 1913, I like the earlier ones! Ed

06-01-2009, 05:22 PM	#2
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,935 Thanks: 2,034 Thanked 4,533 Times in 2,093 Posts	Well hell..... I tried to put all the threads into a new thread and instead merged them into one posting Bill. Sorry about that. ed

06-02-2009, 02:41 PM	#8
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,772 Thanks: 4,940 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	What does the little lever on the back of the side plate do? The parts seem very small and look somewhat fragile. Thanks, Bill Bill..This is the trigger transfer lever. It is held in by a dogleg pin and the lever rotates on it. The trigger has a slot in the top of it that the bottom of the lever fits into when the sideplate is installed. When the trigger is pulled down... the L shape angle of this transfer bar pushes in on the fireing pin sear found along the left side rail of the barrel & top cannon. When this sear is pushed inward.. it pivots on it's own pin and moves out of the way of the cocked flange on the fireing pin..releasing it so the compressed fireing pin spring will drive it forward to strike the primer of the cartridge found in the barrel chamber. You might notice that when the safety is activated.. it simply moves up from it's recess in the receiver and blocks the sear from pivoting out and releasing the flange on the fireing pin. One thing to note..If there is a cartridge in the chamber and the top cannon assembly is completely off of the bottom handle of the pistol, the top cannon can be fired by simply pushing in on the front of the exposed sear bar. Jerry Burney __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 l[email protected] 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know."

06-02-2009, 04:29 PM	#9
lugerholsterrepair Moderator Lifetime Forum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Arizona/Colorado Posts: 7,772 Thanks: 4,940 Thanked 3,124 Times in 1,434 Posts	Your mail to the following recipients could not be delivered because they are not accepting mail from [email protected]: arribur Thank you. The lever that releases the side plate, the same lever that raises a stop that fits into the bottom of the barrel limits the barrel's travel on recoil against the spring? This is theside plate locking lever. This lever does not limit the barrel's travel on recoil..there is a lug on the underside of the top cannon that performs this function. How far should you be able to pull up the toggles? The spring is rather strong, as you know. Should the toggles stay in place upright if you pull back far enough? The toggle will only stay upright if the holdopen spring is present. This spring will ONLY activate if the magazine is in the weapon and the weapon is empty. Insert an empty magazine in the pistol and pull back on the toggle forcefully. It should stay open. To release the toggle, drop the magazine a couple of inches and this will release the upward pressure on the holdopen spring, letting it drop out of the way of the notch in the bolt allowing the toggle to release when pulled slightly rearward, once it releases you can let go and the bolt will slam into battery. Mr. Burney, you can tell I am a gun novice. My Dad passed away last year and I am just trying to preserve his stuff and memory best I can. Sorry to hear about your Father..Your doing the right thing. Keep learning, that's what the Forums are for. There are many manuals for the Luger pistol. Go to Ebay, look for luger and you will likely see a manual or two. Below a link to a cheap user manual http://cgi.ebay.com/LUGER-9mm-DISASS...2em118Q2el1247 Jerry __________________ Jerry Burney 11491 S. Guadalupe Drive Yuma AZ 85367-6182 l[email protected] 928 342-7583 (CO & AZ) Year Round 719 207-3331 (cell) "For those who Fight For It, Life has a flavor the protected will never know." Last edited by lugerholsterrepair; 06-02-2009 at 07:39 PM.