luger rifle upper complete ?

num1fordfan · 06-10-2014, 01:10 PM

so i recently obtained a 1915 dwm marked all matching numbers (except for pivot pin at rear of receiver) 16" rifle barrel and complete receiver wondering what it would be worth it definantly could use a reblue and sights are not original pics to follow ... just want to get an idea of worth

Ron Wood · 06-10-2014, 01:40 PM

It looks like the start (or end) of a gunsmith's Luger carbine project. I am assuming that the forestock is not attached to the barrel in any way. I suspect that the forestock is held on to a frame extension with a screw. To complete the carbine you would of course need the frame to go with the upper and it would have to be modified with an extension to attach the forestock. With the 16" barrel, it would be legal to attach a shoulder stock.

I would think that it would be an attractive item for someone interested in making a carbine and would be worth $300-$400 or so. I would buy it for that if you are interested in selling.
Ron

sheepherder · 06-10-2014, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

I am assuming that the forestock is not attached to the barrel in any way. I suspect that the forestock is held on to a frame extension with a screw.

Hard to tell if the barrel has any attachments like a Luger carbine has...Numrich used to sell a 16" barrel with forestock shown mounted to the barrel...

sheepherder · 06-15-2014, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

I would think that it...would be worth $300-$400 or so. I would buy it for that...

I had thought that Ron's estimate was way too much, but I see it is at $305 with 5 days yet to go, so that shows how little I know about Luger pricing...

Having a complete toggle train adds to it, I suppose...

Insistence on an unneeded FFL transfer will of course cut into both the seller's and the buyer's money, and there is the GB fee as well.

Interesting...

LugerVern · 06-15-2014, 11:56 PM

I am glad to see it going for some dollars

I had this in my possession for a while , if memory serves it head spaces correctly and the barrel looks pretty nice inside.

Very nice setup on the rear adjustable sight, proper height for the front sight.

It shouldn't take too much to get it functional .

Pick your favorite ammo and calibrate the recoil accordingly.

Should make someone very happy, would like to see the finished product posted for us to look at one day.

Vern

sheepherder · 06-16-2014, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LugerVern

I had this in my possession for a while...

Vern, can you tell us a bit more about it??? The peep sight base looks like it might be pinned in place...Do you know what it came off of???

num1fordfan · 06-10-2014, 04:11 PM

ive no clue ive never owned a luger , there is a hole in the rear of the forearm where it looks as if something would go up in it , the receiver and bolt all match no serial number on the barrel .... there is a hole half way up the forearm for a screw

Edward Tinker · 06-10-2014, 04:32 PM

I have had several of these, but they were complete (with the frame and parts).

I tried selling for $1500 and went down from there, finally sold the complete thing for around $1000 I think

These long uppers are tricky in getting them to fire a 9mm more than single shot...

Ed

Ron Wood · 06-10-2014, 07:05 PM

A forestock attached to a barrel will flat not function. First of all there has to be about 3/8 inch free space between the rear of the stock and the receiver or the receiver will not move during recoil and the action will not cycle. Secondly, even with the free space the weight of the forestock inhibits cycling so every round jams, and you can't hold the forestock while shooting as that further exacerbates the problem.

sheepherder · 06-10-2014, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick W.

The ones that feature the wood attached to the longish barrel are at best single shots...

I would not mind a Luger rifle that required hand cycling or pump operation...I wouldn't particularly like to have to hand cycle the toggle, but if a Borchardt style toggle knob was attached it might make it bearable...

Now I'm wondering if a barrel attached forearm could be made pump action...A long rod connecting a sliding/movable forearm to the toggle...And a lock so it won't recoil until you manually unlock it...Hmmmm...

I've seen the Numrich 16" barrels for sale on GB/eBay (with and without attached forearm); I suppose that is because the owners found out that it wasn't an easy swap-out...

num1fordfan · 06-13-2014, 03:12 PM

well gentlemen i have listed this on gunbroker ... starting auction at 0.01 and will let it ride out .... i know too little about lugers to set a price so i will let the community tell me what they want to pay .... my screen name on gunbroker is MUDBOGGINFORDS87 .... thank yall for yalls input

Ron Wood · 06-13-2014, 06:24 PM

How do you have it listed? I can't find it. Do you have an item number?

Olle · 06-14-2014, 12:19 AM

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=422476118

Ron Wood · 06-14-2014, 01:11 AM

Thank you Olle. The auction ad is in error as by BATFE rules it is not a firearm and does not require a FFL or C&R. I will watch the progress and may consider a bid.

alanint · 06-14-2014, 08:06 AM

As a matter of etiquette, if you are going to come onto the site and mine free advice and a valuation for something you are planning to sell, the polite thing to do is to offer it here first, especially if interest has been expressed.

sheepherder · 06-14-2014, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alanint

As a matter of etiquette, if you are going to come onto the site and mine free advice and a valuation for something you are planning to sell, the polite thing to do is to offer it here first, especially if interest has been expressed.

In the context of the current Internet and 'gun' forums in particular, I don't see anything impolite of note. Most all forums allow sellers to dictate the terms of sale, and friends are routinely given preference over 'first responders'.

There seems to be some kind of feeling that if another forum member is bidding on an item, the rest of the forum should 'back off'. I don't believe in this. It's an auction! If you want it, bid on it! The Devil take the hindmost!

Lugerdoc · 06-14-2014, 09:53 AM

I've worked on a few of these 16" rebarrelled lugers. The most difficult part of the process is to come up with a recoil spring that will allow this heavy barrel to cycle properly. I do fine the adjustable rear sight interesting. TH

num1fordfan · 06-16-2014, 12:36 PM

i was under the impression just like a ruger mkII this was the part that had to have paper work done on it if i am wrong and someone can send me something stating that this item does not infact have to go through a dealer please let me know ... vern ive sent you a pm on vgt

Ron Wood · 06-16-2014, 01:24 PM

num1fordfan
I don't have a document quickly at hand, but I have been dealing in Lugers for over 50 years and I can assure you that the BATFE considers the frame as the control part which must be transferred through a FFL or C&R, but the receiver does not require any official transfer.

num1fordfan · 06-16-2014, 01:33 PM

thank you ron , i was under the impression it was like the ruger mkII where the "frame" is considered the "grip frame" ..... i will make changes to my auction ............ NOW TO RESPOND TO THIS "As a matter of etiquette, if you are going to come onto the site and mine free advice and a valuation for something you are planning to sell, the polite thing to do is to offer it here first, especially if interest has been expressed." i know nothing about lugers (ima ruger man) i was just trying to get the opinion of people i figured would know , when i sell something rare i always put it on gunbroker and start it at .01 , case in point i had a amt longslide guy offered me $700 i declined and listed it on gunbroker $1525.01 later it sold ..... when i have an item i am not familiar with the value on i would much rather put it to auction

06-10-2014, 01:10 PM	#1
num1fordfan User Join Date: Jun 2014 Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	luger rifle upper complete ? so i recently obtained a 1915 dwm marked all matching numbers (except for pivot pin at rear of receiver) 16" rifle barrel and complete receiver wondering what it would be worth it definantly could use a reblue and sights are not original pics to follow ... just want to get an idea of worth Attached Thumbnails

06-10-2014, 01:40 PM	#2
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,022 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,179 Times in 1,703 Posts	It looks like the start (or end) of a gunsmith's Luger carbine project. I am assuming that the forestock is not attached to the barrel in any way. I suspect that the forestock is held on to a frame extension with a screw. To complete the carbine you would of course need the frame to go with the upper and it would have to be modified with an extension to attach the forestock. With the 16" barrel, it would be legal to attach a shoulder stock. I would think that it would be an attractive item for someone interested in making a carbine and would be worth $300-$400 or so. I would buy it for that if you are interested in selling. Ron __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

06-10-2014, 04:32 PM	#8
Edward Tinker Super Moderator Eternal Lifer LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: North of Spokane, WA Posts: 15,935 Thanks: 2,034 Thanked 4,533 Times in 2,093 Posts	I have had several of these, but they were complete (with the frame and parts). I tried selling for $1500 and went down from there, finally sold the complete thing for around $1000 I think These long uppers are tricky in getting them to fire a 9mm more than single shot... Ed __________________ Edward Tinker ************ Co-Author of Police Lugers - Co-Author of Simson Lugers Author of Veteran Bring Backs Vol I, Vol II, Vol III and Vol IV

06-10-2014, 07:05 PM	#9
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,022 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,179 Times in 1,703 Posts	A forestock attached to a barrel will flat not function. First of all there has to be about 3/8 inch free space between the rear of the stock and the receiver or the receiver will not move during recoil and the action will not cycle. Secondly, even with the free space the weight of the forestock inhibits cycling so every round jams, and you can't hold the forestock while shooting as that further exacerbates the problem. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

06-13-2014, 06:24 PM	#12
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,022 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,179 Times in 1,703 Posts	How do you have it listed? I can't find it. Do you have an item number? __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

06-15-2014, 11:56 PM	#5
LugerVern User Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Virginia Posts: 563 Thanks: 1 Thanked 34 Times in 27 Posts	I am glad to see it going for some dollars I had this in my possession for a while , if memory serves it head spaces correctly and the barrel looks pretty nice inside. Very nice setup on the rear adjustable sight, proper height for the front sight. It shouldn't take too much to get it functional . Pick your favorite ammo and calibrate the recoil accordingly. Should make someone very happy, would like to see the finished product posted for us to look at one day. Vern

06-10-2014, 04:11 PM	#7
num1fordfan User Join Date: Jun 2014 Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	ive no clue ive never owned a luger , there is a hole in the rear of the forearm where it looks as if something would go up in it , the receiver and bolt all match no serial number on the barrel .... there is a hole half way up the forearm for a screw

06-13-2014, 03:12 PM	#11
num1fordfan User Join Date: Jun 2014 Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	well gentlemen i have listed this on gunbroker ... starting auction at 0.01 and will let it ride out .... i know too little about lugers to set a price so i will let the community tell me what they want to pay .... my screen name on gunbroker is MUDBOGGINFORDS87 .... thank yall for yalls input

06-14-2014, 12:19 AM	#13
Olle User Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 1,149 Thanks: 159 Thanked 663 Times in 318 Posts	http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=422476118

06-14-2014, 01:11 AM	#14
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,022 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,179 Times in 1,703 Posts	Thank you Olle. The auction ad is in error as by BATFE rules it is not a firearm and does not require a FFL or C&R. I will watch the progress and may consider a bid. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

06-14-2014, 08:06 AM	#15
alanint User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Marco Island, Florida Posts: 4,867 Thanks: 1,685 Thanked 1,916 Times in 1,192 Posts	As a matter of etiquette, if you are going to come onto the site and mine free advice and a valuation for something you are planning to sell, the polite thing to do is to offer it here first, especially if interest has been expressed.

06-14-2014, 09:53 AM	#17
Lugerdoc Patron LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: POB 398 St.Charles,MO. 63302 Posts: 5,089 Thanks: 6 Thanked 736 Times in 483 Posts	I've worked on a few of these 16" rebarrelled lugers. The most difficult part of the process is to come up with a recoil spring that will allow this heavy barrel to cycle properly. I do fine the adjustable rear sight interesting. TH __________________ Tom Heller POB 398 ST.Charles, MO. 63302 Tel 636-447-3006 [email protected]

06-16-2014, 12:36 PM	#18
num1fordfan User Join Date: Jun 2014 Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	i was under the impression just like a ruger mkII this was the part that had to have paper work done on it if i am wrong and someone can send me something stating that this item does not infact have to go through a dealer please let me know ... vern ive sent you a pm on vgt

06-16-2014, 01:24 PM	#19
Ron Wood Moderator 2010 LugerForum Patron Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Santa Teresa New Mexico just outside of the West Texas town of El Paso Posts: 7,022 Thanks: 1,090 Thanked 5,179 Times in 1,703 Posts	num1fordfan I don't have a document quickly at hand, but I have been dealing in Lugers for over 50 years and I can assure you that the BATFE considers the frame as the control part which must be transferred through a FFL or C&R, but the receiver does not require any official transfer. __________________ If it's made after 1918...it's a reproduction

06-16-2014, 01:33 PM	#20
num1fordfan User Join Date: Jun 2014 Posts: 5 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	thank you ron , i was under the impression it was like the ruger mkII where the "frame" is considered the "grip frame" ..... i will make changes to my auction ............ NOW TO RESPOND TO THIS "As a matter of etiquette, if you are going to come onto the site and mine free advice and a valuation for something you are planning to sell, the polite thing to do is to offer it here first, especially if interest has been expressed." i know nothing about lugers (ima ruger man) i was just trying to get the opinion of people i figured would know , when i sell something rare i always put it on gunbroker and start it at .01 , case in point i had a amt longslide guy offered me $700 i declined and listed it on gunbroker $1525.01 later it sold ..... when i have an item i am not familiar with the value on i would much rather put it to auction