Purported Hugo Borchardt signature

[Hugo Borchardt]

EBay item 301440196696 claims to be a check to Borchardt with his signature on reverse.

[alvin]

Could be genuine. I guess there are many people with this name, German population is not tiny.

[Mauser 712]

To the best of my knowledge, he did work at one time at the Sharps rifle company, so his signature on the rear of the check could be valid and genuine.

Albert

[cirelaw]

Albert, I tracked him down it you don't mind. ~Eric http://www.nramuseum.com/guns/the-ga...mid-range.aspx

[Mauser 712]

Good research Eric!

Since the M1878 Sharps-Borchardt rifle was manufactured between 1878-1881, and that check is dated from May 1877, it is a very strong possibility that the signature is his while we was working at the Sharps factory. As the American factory owners were always known to be tight asses without recognizing better improvements, it probably explains why Hugo Borchardt left the US to continue his work in Germany ;-)

If a collector wants to own something connected to HB, this might be a good item to win at a reasonable price. I would like to one day see a photo of HB if such a photo can be verified.

Best wishes,
Albert

[alvin]

Wait a minute... this piece of paper being dated as 18xx?

What's the other side, a pay check?

[Ron Wood]

Originally Posted by alvin

Wait a minute... this piece of paper being dated as 18xx?

What's the other side, a pay check?

Yep.

[Ron Wood]

Originally Posted by Mauser 712

Good research Eric!

Since the M1878 Sharps-Borchardt rifle was manufactured between 1878-1881, and that check is dated from May 1877, it is a very strong possibility that the signature is his while we was working at the Sharps factory. As the American factory owners were always known to be tight asses without recognizing better improvements, it probably explains why Hugo Borchardt left the US to continue his work in Germany ;-)

If a collector wants to own something connected to HB, this might be a good item to win at a reasonable price. I would like to one day see a photo of HB if such a photo can be verified.

Best wishes,
Albert

Albert,
In 2012 an individual by the name of Gordon Bruce published a 8.5"X11", 164 page paperback book "The Evolution of Military Automatic Pistols/Self-loading Pistol Designs of Two World Wars and the Men who Invented Them". It is a pretty nice effort with a good amount of historical information that all-in-all is reasonably accurate (there is always some room for improvement but I found it rather good and would recommend it for enjoyable reading).There are thumbnail biographies of lots of early firearms designers, Krnka, Feederle Brothers, Luger, Browning, etc. The write-up on Borchardt included two photos at different times in his life. This was exciting to me so I contacted the author regarding the source of the photos. It was a rather disappointing reply that he had gotten them from "a collector in Poland" several years ago and couldn't provide any further information on them. For what it is worth here is one of the photos. (by the way, you might enjoy the book if you can find one)

Also by-the-way, those American factory owners (Colt, Singer and Sharps) employed Borchardt's ideas and paid him handsomely (for the time) for his efforts. The Sharps-Borchardt rifle remains a masterpiece of American engineering, but alas was "too modern" so it did not enjoy the sales level it deserved. And while you are busy down-playing American industry please remember that Ludwig Loewe came to American to study American manufacturing processes and those processes became the foundation for much of Loewe's success and subsequent establishment of European standards. Please abandon your anti-American bias, enjoy the blessings of the season, and have a happy and prosperous New Year.
Ron

[cirelaw]

Found it http://www.gunandswordcollector.com/...ges/bruce.html

[cirelaw]

Good Ole Amazon http://www.amazon.com/Evolution-Mili.../dp/1931464537 Eric $26.99~~~

[cirelaw]

The reviews~~ http://www.amazon.com/Evolution-Mili...owViewpoints=1

[Mauser 712]

Originally Posted by Ron Wood

Albert,
In 2012 an individual by the name of Gordon Bruce published a 8.5"X11", 164 page paperback book "The Evolution of Military Automatic Pistols/Self-loading Pistol Designs of Two World Wars and the Men who Invented Them". It is a pretty nice effort with a good amount of historical information that all-in-all is reasonably accurate (there is always some room for improvement but I found it rather good and would recommend it for enjoyable reading).There are thumbnail biographies of lots of early firearms designers, Krnka, Feederle Brothers, Luger, Browning, etc. The write-up on Borchardt included two photos at different times in his life. This was exciting to me so I contacted the author regarding the source of the photos. It was a rather disappointing reply that he had gotten them from "a collector in Poland" several years ago and couldn't provide any further information on them. For what it is worth here is one of the photos. (by the way, you might enjoy the book if you can find one)

Also by-the-way, those American factory owners (Colt, Singer and Sharps) employed Borchardt's ideas and paid him handsomely (for the time) for his efforts. The Sharps-Borchardt rifle remains a masterpiece of American engineering, but alas was "too modern" so it did not enjoy the sales level it deserved. And while you are busy down-playing American industry please remember that Ludwig Loewe came to American to study American manufacturing processes and those processes became the foundation for much of Loewe's success and subsequent establishment of European standards. Please abandon your anti-American bias, enjoy the blessings of the season, and have a happy and prosperous New Year.
Ron

Greetings Ron,

Thanks for the information regarding an image of H. Borchardt. I saw the same image on another web site that you added to your post, and do you reckon that it is a correct image of him?

I was only joking about the "tight arse" comment by giving a funny explanation for the reason he left the US. Notice that I placed a ;-) wink after my previous post.

It is the Christmas season, so lighten up, Mate

Where is my Christmas present from you? I'll accept a check from you as long as it does not BOUNCE

Cheers,
Albert

[alvin]

A little bit surprised on Borchardt's image, he looks like being an Indian.. The first time I saw this image was from a pistol patent booklet published a few years ago, but did not pay much attention at that time. Obviously, this image is now accepted by mainstram Luger collectors. Where did this image come from, provenance?

Borchardt was a naturalized US citizen... probably had a picture on immigration paperworks. But not sure that data being searchable or not by public.

[Norme]

Actually $161.33 back in the 1870's would be quite a lot of money in today's dollars. There are several different ways of computing this, but in terms of wages or salaries it comes to about $35,000.00.
Regards, Norm

[nukem556]

Not understanding the link between this check and the Sharps Co. It appears to be from the US Gov't Internal Revenue?

[alanint]

Originally Posted by Mauser 712

Good research Eric!

Since the M1878 Sharps-Borchardt rifle was manufactured between 1878-1881, and that check is dated from May 1877, it is a very strong possibility that the signature is his while we was working at the Sharps factory. As the American factory owners were always known to be tight asses without recognizing better improvements, it probably explains why Hugo Borchardt left the US to continue his work in Germany ;-)

If a collector wants to own something connected to HB, this might be a good item to win at a reasonable price. I would like to one day see a photo of HB if such a photo can be verified.

Best wishes,
Albert

Perhaps a search for "E.G. Wulcott" among those company's managements would help authenticate this check.

[cirelaw]

I performed the search, "E.G. Wulcott" nothing, The Invisable Man!

[mauro]

Gents,
This is a very nice document because provide at the same time the signature of Borchardt (quite rare indeed) and E. G. Westcott President and Treasurer of the Sharp Rifle Company (below a letter signed by him with also his head letter).
By the way, the first traced evidence of the Borchardt in the weapons field is actually a letter Borchardt wrote to Westcott on the 18th March 1875.
Due to the amount of money, this is a payment for the royalties of the patent for the Sharps-Borchardt rifle that is dated 1876.
Very interesting document.
Cheers,
Mauro

[Ben M.]

check on ebay founded new home for 250 usd

[Ben M.]

check on ebay found new home for 250 usd

in this link another check a few months sooner that westcott wrote to himself:
http://www.soldusa.com/rainworx/deta...6&bigpic=0#img

on back it is cancelled when spent. ebay check is not cancelled.