Luger Proof/Acceptance Mark Link

[rpbcps]

I found this page while looking for more information on Luger Proof/Acceptance Marks:

http://www.germandaggers.com/Gallery/GLP.php

Has some interesting information on it, with some good photos.

Richard

[gunnertwo]

I'd like to know where he got his info on the "Circle S" markings. So far, no one knows.

Great images.

G2

[Dwight Gruber]

Much obsolete, old "conventional wisdom", false information here. Do not trust it.


--Dwight

[LU1900]

I have the "Constanzo" and love it , perhaps not perfect

[rpbcps]

Originally Posted by Dwight Gruber

Much obsolete, old "conventional wisdom", false information here. Do not trust it.


--Dwight

Dwight,
Perhaps not perfect, and has mistakes in it, but I found the photos very good and it gives me something to work from; I can update where necessary, as I confirm errors, using the many posts found on the Lugerforum, related to the subject.

Stay safe
Richard

[Edward Tinker]

For me, it is the assumptions on Simson that show old information - but its a good visual ref - print it out using 'Landscape' as pdf and save to a folder

[Vlim]

Dutch KOL marking is also incorrectly described. It's not a Dutch air force marking, but that of the Department of Colonies, the ministry responsible for colonial matters.

[rpbcps]

Originally Posted by Vlim

Dutch KOL marking is also incorrectly described. It's not a Dutch air force marking, but that of the Department of Colonies, the ministry responsible for colonial matters.

Vlim,
Yep, I am guessing the website has not been updated for many years and was wrote when it was still believed that those lugers were part of a contract specifically for the Dutch Air force.

I believe that the KOL stamping has been much deliberated over the years. I read at one time it was believed to be the marking for Koninklijke Landmacht, (Royal European Army), however, the Dutch 'European' army, were issued with FN pistols from 1925. Others, like germandaggers.com, claimed that it was the marking for the Koninklijke Luchmacht, (Royal Air Force). Indeed, the seller from whom I purchased my Dutch M11, incorrectly described it as ‘Rare Royal Dutch Air Force’ Model 1900 parabellum.

However, as members of this forum will be aware, that there was no separate stand-alone 1928 BKIW contract for the “Dutch Air Force,” as in 1928, the Air force was part of the Dutch Army. Therefore there is no definitive association of the K.L. mark with the Dutch Air Force. So as you correctly point out, the marking relates to the Koninklijk Nederlands Indisch Leger (K.N.I.L.), Royal Dutch Indian Army.

In an article in 'Guns Review' in February 1974, on the subject of the Dutch luger, the author added this information to the subject of the KOL stamping.

The author Dick Deibel had access to the notes made by a former D.W.M. / Mauser employee, Herr Weisz. Mr Weisz was in DWMs employment at the time of the last delivery of DWM Lugers to the Dutch Indies and Royal Dutch Navy. The Royal Dutch Navy incorporated the Luger in pistol into their armory in 1928. “Mr Weisz kept notes on all relations between DWM and the Dutch authorities who were in charge of the acceptance of this material. I will, however, lift one apparent point from them. Through all his notes Mr Weisz makes a definitive difference between the relations with the Royal Dutch Navy and the Colonies.”

So, due to Royal Dutch Navy’s requirements being distinct, each entry in his notes was marked as a reference for either the Navy or for the colonies. Mr Deibel goes on to state, “from this I have come to one conclusion. “KL” in a circle is not KL in a circle, but a styled KOL. In German, as well as in Dutch, the word ‘Kolonien’, (colony) is a word that Mr Weisz always used in his notes. It is obvious the Dutch Lugers for the Navy and Kolonien had to be kept apart. The frames were already different, as the Dutch Navy luger pistols in contrast to the colonial have a lug for the shoulder stock, but no grip safety, hence they needed no special marking. They had to be kept apart through a special mark before finishing. The more I read Mr Weisz’ notes the more I came to the conclusion that KOL was made into an emblem and used for identification”.

Food for thought.