'41 byf Jersey Liberated Luger

[Lugerdoc]

Brendan, Nice "Black Widow" PO8 rig. If it was actually left behind in the CI, the only part of GB occupied by the Nazis during WW2, I find more interesting than the gun itself. If I were you I would certainly try to get as much documention to this as possible, as that would probably make it rarer than your XKE. The only other Lugers that I've heard about that were captured during the war in the UK, were a few from crashed flight crews and perhaps some smuggled into Ireland. I found the BBC drama about the CI in WW2 facinating. Do you have any good stories yourself or from relatives? TH

[Balder]

Brendan,

Congrats on your byf 41, what a great rig! I am also pleasantly surprised to learn that there still are parts of the British isles where you can actually own live guns. How many hoops did you have to jump through in order to accomplish that?

I hope you get that M1928 Thompson, I also have one - it was in the first batch of 10,000 Thompsons bought by your people in 1940. I also have two WW1 Lugers that came out of the UK during WW2, you can read more in this thread:

http://forum.lugerforum.com/showthre...threadid=15863

Good luck!

Balder

[minigun]

very, very nice sir.

[Balder]

Dear Mr. Tacfoley,

Thank you for a very enlightening run-down of British gun legislation - quite informative and scary, if I may say so. Having spent ten years as an Army officer, I don't think I'd like some rookie desk-jockey supervise my use of my own guns either.
My M1928 Thompson and my Vickers heavy MG are legally full-auto, but I had to convert the STENgun, the BRENgun, the Suomi M-1931, the FN-FAL G1 and the CZ-25 to semi only. Go figure.

Speaking of the IRA, my CZ-25 came out of an IRA weapons dump years ago. When I got it, it was full of soil and flour - it turned out that this particular dump had been uncovered on a farm somewhere in Northern Ireland.

If you - or anybody else on here - ever come to Norway, I'd be more than happy to take you to the range to do some full-auto shooting.

Regards,

Balder

[Balder]

Tac,

Those were happy days in deed. Among many other things I taught arctic warfare to quite a few of your countrymen, I wouldn't rule out that our paths have crossed before.

I had the pleasure (well, usually it was a pleasure) of teaching your SAS as well as your regular army how to freeze, fire & survive in the correct military way. This usually took place at Voss, Trandum and Bardufoss back in the early/mid 80's.

Stay in touch!

Balder

[ChannelIsles]

Hi all,
Perhaps Jersey has taken a more tolerant view of firearms.
Last week I has the pleasure of firing a german '41 MP 38, a 1928 Thompson, a modern H&K MP5 (all carbines) & a .44 magnum revolver (but that's another story). The H&K held the tightest group, I believe the others operate with an open bolt & hence a slower movement - 32 bullets in each magazine so plenty to shot with.
Should I desire to acquire any of these, my Firearm's licence permits me to list these as carbines (although all have been converted to single shot mechanisms).
The largest I know held locally are the .50 brownings - the ammo's a trifle steep so I'll stick with the 9 & 45mm for the moment.

Having spoken with other pistol owners - It's not unusual to find the odd luger that father 'acquired' on Liberation or post from one of the underground tunnels. Some luger ownership goes to double figures so perhaps not so rare to find one or two for sale from time to time.

As for tales during the occupation - unfortunately a grim time for all I'm afraid, near starvation even for the Germans at the end, although a number of modest but extremely brave individuals sheltered Jewish and escaped Polish slave workers and risked deportation to one of the concentration camps and likely death. I wasn't born but both parents were here at the start of the occupation.

I hope to post some more topical pictures of any acquisitions shortly.
Brendan

[lugercollector]

Hi Brendan....I grew up in England and visited the Channel Islands as a 12 year old in 1966 as part of a youth camp group...myself and a couple of buddies found and gained access to a tunnel that was underneath a Church(the Church was on a hilltop)...we dicovered Helmets,Jackboots gas mask canisters and tons of German WW2 items.....a real treasure trove!!.....I sometimes wonder if these tunnels still exist???

[ChannelIsles]

Hi,
The tunnel system you refer to is under St Saviour's church in Guernsey - I'll find some diagrams & post.

In Jersey, quite a complex tunnel system was underway during the 5 years of occupation with at least 15 listed around the Island:
Ho1 St Peters Valley â?? munitions store â?? under construction but in use
Ho2 St Peters Valley â?? ration store â?? under construction.
Ho3 Bellozanne Valley â?? munitions store â?? planning stage only.
Ho4 Grand Vaux munitions store â?? under construction but in use.
Ho5 St Aubin â?? Fuel store but used to store munitions.
H06 St Peters Valley (Le Pissot) personnel shelter â?? completed but sealed and obliterated in 45/46.
Ho7 St. Peters Valley (Cap Verd) â?? Artillery reserves â?? exploratory work only (rear entrance to Ho8 is also here).
Ho8 St Peters Valley Artillery Quarters â?? under construction but in use.
Ho9 Bellozanne Valley electricity works 1 â?? planning stage only.
H10 Grand Vaux ration store 2 â?? under construction.
H11 Grands Vaux personnel shelter- believed completed but sealed and obliterated in 45/46.
H12 Grands Vaux fuel store 2 â?? exploratory work only.
H13 Beaumont Valley munition store 4 â?? under construction.
H14 Mont au Roux fuel store 3 â?? exploratory work only.
H15 Beaumont Valley â?? purpose unknown â?? under construction.

H 16 / 17 / 18 Nothing known as to location or purpose or if completed !

Ho19 St. Helier harbour (La Folie) â?? electricity works â?? under construction and used to store munitions.

A number were used to dispose of hand & artillery weapons, equipment, lorries even, the remnants of one such forgotten lorry may be viewed on the following mini film. The size of these tunnel systems can be quite considerable.


Enjoy,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNeuijh10bE

http://www.occupied.guernsey.net/fortifications.htm

Brendan

[lugercollector]

Hi Brendan......Thank You for the fascinating information!!!.....Cheers....Peter

[Lugerdoc]

Brendan, Thanks for the extentive list of Nazi constructions. As I recall, I believe that they built an airfield on one of the islands: or did they just use an existing commerical one? St.Heller harbor? Must not have been one of my Jewish German ancestors. Tom Heller